KREM-2 in the prophecy business?

15 comments on this post so far. Add yours!

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  Diana on May 26 at 7:28 a.m.

  Or perhaps they were just being overly dramatic, as usual.

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  JeanieSpokane on May 26 at 8:23 a.m.

  And we wonder why everyone goes into panic mode for just about anything. Good grief!

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  ChefGus/ John Olsen on May 26 at 9:46 a.m.

  perhaps they were just being hysteric… fear sells ….. gus

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  George_Sands on May 26 at 3:01 p.m.

  Perhaps their reduced news reporting staff grabbed the first graphic they could find without thinking through what they were doing. There are some (public domain) quite striking pictures of their nucleur plants provided by the CIA/Google Earth etc. They just had look for them.

  I’m not concerned regarding DPRK having a atomic or even a nuclear weapon (there is a difference folks) or having a method of delivering them (missiles). What we (as a Nation/Government) should be considering (and communicating to them) is that if they do decide to drop the bomb on some nation, what are WE going to do about it? We will have the fortitude to respond/not respond in kind? Or with our precision standoff conventional weapons take out their government/military headquarters? or will it be a U.N. response which will take months to plan/debate?

  On the other hand having a viable WMD as a sales item to some other rogue government/group should be considered. DPRK doesnt have a great economy (no technology/cant grow enough food to feed itself) and so will they be building these for sale and how much?

  Personnaly I had hope that DPRK and ROK would someday join together like E/W Germany, but by doing so would pose an even GREATER economic threat to Japan and the U.S. So there is the belief that they will be played off against each other for a long long time thanks to the U.S. Government.

  Read the history of Korea and how the Japanese subjugated their country/society for 40 years and raped their natural resources to fuel the Japanese expansion into the Western Hemisphere/Pacific Theatre of Operations leading up to WW II.

  I have a healthy respect for the Koreans. They are one tough people.

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  ChefGus/ John Olsen on May 26 at 4:45 p.m.

  George…thanks for your fine comments… some of the very very best physicians I have worked with over the years are Koreans.. exceptional people.. that were indeed at the bottom of the asian pecking order…

  It will be interesting to see what President Obama does to bring people to the table in the face of “REAL” wmd… dont know myself what the difference between Nuclear Weapons.. ( does that include the heavy metal shrapnel and loads for our rifles and cannons?) and Atomic Weapons means.. help me there if you would…

  I have read about the dense armor piercing “bullets”… and their propensity to contaminate the ground/environs and create horrific cancer’s and birth defects in Iraq etc…. not much in the MSM about that… akin to the agent orange of the Viet Nam era… and the ” chemistry” that we used in the Gulf War.. ( which you may know of).. and how that brings our own soldiers to the Veterans Hospitals in droves….

  when it gets to crux time… and we are blathering about Iran as a “potential” i was in hopes that Ambassador Crocker could learn Korean real quick and perhaps consider “extending” his service career to go back to Korea…. ( hard to give up life in Spokane I know, but someone has to do it? )

  Tell me more about the weaponry? and the “small caliber Nukes” that are on the ground as detritus from our Iraq venture?? best j

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  George_Sands on May 26 at 10:35 p.m.

  I’m going try to keep this easy w/o all the heavy math/physics. Most is from the top of my head from physics classes in the early 70’s.

  An atomic weapon (Like we gave Japan) consists of fissionable material Isotope Uranium U235 (only naturally occuring as small percentages in nature (0.72 percent)) has to be separated from normal occuring Uranium (U235 + U238). There are several techingues from centrifugal to gas separators. The bottom line is to get weapons grade Uranium (U-235) is just not a simple task. U-235 gets to be very poisonous and of course anything that it touches also gets contaminated.

  Then one has to shape the U-235 into 2 semi hemispherical parts and keep them separated and shielded. To trigger the bomb requires very technical thermistors that shove the two hemispheres together in order to reach “critical mass”. I.e. where enough atoms randomly split releasting radiation (particles/waveS) to cause other atoms to split. i.e. fission.

  The second bomb in Japan was I think Plutonium which occurs in nature but is made in breeder reactors by bombarding U-238 with neutrons (particles) from U-235 fission.

  So in review an Atomic Bomb is fissionable material. The ones we dropped in japan were rudimentary and probably only used about 10% of the power possible. We have been busy beavers and gotten the Atomic Bomb down to about 10 Kilo’s (20 or so lbs) of fissionable material needed. Small enough to be used in artillery, suitcases etc. etc. Even an inefficiant atomic bomb i.e. “dirty bomb” will ruin your day. I think the Japan ones were on the order of 20 - 40 kiloton yield of explosive. We now have “dialable” yields of up to 5 megatons (500? times more powerful) and above.. AKA “CIty Busters” that would make Nagasaki look like a fire cracker.

  Nuclear Weapons. Nuclear materials are the key ingredients in nuclear weapons. They include fissile, fussionable and source materials. Fissile materials are those which are composed of atoms that can be split by neutrons in a self-sustaining chain-reaction to release energy, and include plutonium-239 and uranium-235. Fussionable materials are those in which the atoms can be fused in order to release energy, and include deuterium and tritium. Source materials are those which are used to boost nuclear weapons by providing a source of additional atomic particles for fission. They include tritium, polonium, beryllium, lithium-6 and helium-3.

  here is some good info material. There is a lot on the web.

  http://www.nuclearfiles.org/menu/key-issues/nuclear-weapons/basics/nuclear-materials.htm

  in Review. Getting fissionable material is HARD. Putting it together in a weapon is HARD, Making it work is HARD. There are several papers on HOW to do it.

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  George_Sands on May 26 at 10:35 p.m.

  There are several agencies military/government that monitor and prepare for these “events”. We have specific aircraft/ships that fly near/over foreign shipping that can detect the radium in an old style watch. Several years ago near Blaine “they” were monitoriing freeway traffic near Burlington. They got some hot hits… so they flagged/stopped a car down. In it there was a pet cat that had undergone some radiation treatment several days previously. Link to the story. Scary. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/dannywestneat/2004300343_danny23.html

  There is a group called NEST Nuclear Emergency Search Teams.. that have near 007 authority to kill on sight in the event of nuclear events. I saw them in an “event” in Las Vegas about 15 years ago.

  They are also now “salting” any atomic/nuclear material so that it can be tracked back to where it came from.

  U-238 is more dense than lead. So it makes good stopping power for bullets/projectiles. We used a lot in the Middle East. U238 is totally INERT. it has NO radiation properties. However being a heavy metal it maybe be poisonous just as lead or mercury is. So there is a lot floating around the battle fields of Iraq etc. Just like lead or mercury dont eat it or breath it. Its not the radiation its just taht its poisonus in its own right.

  John/Chef/Gus if you need/want more info, you know how to reach me.

  Prosecuting a war in Korea has been wargamed to death. We plan to stop/slow them down while we get all the logistics/weapons/men over to the penisula. Ulchi Focus Lens, Team Spirit and other exercises are mainly logistics. Who goes where, what commands do they come from? Where do they come in? Where do we put them? How do we get them to the battle areas? How do we feed them, ammo and supply them. Fuel, Oil, Water, bandages and bullets. etc. etc.

  It used to be that the U.S. maintained the Korean Command Structure, its been turned over to the ROKs. We just back field them now. Politics.

  The DPRK have some nasty large artillery pieces (thanks to S. Africa, arms dealer w/25 mile range. Wooden gliders and a diesel subs. And some Scuds.. there are Patriot Batteries at most the U.S./ROK military batteries on rotating deployment.

  Our intelligent oversight on DPRK is immense, and so they have gone underground to avoid our snoops. Also very tough for HUMINT to interject long term sleepers into N. Korea. Most the Humint we get is from defectors (whose chance of getting across the border are slim, fat and none).

  Sorry I rambled. I got on a role.

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  ChefGus/ John Olsen on May 27 at 5:21 a.m.

  George… it is quite amazing all of that came out of your brain and memory.. it was interesting to say the least…

  what do you know about the spent bullets on/in the ground in Iraq and the cancers and birth defects? the long term effect of 235 in the environment may be the thing that cooks our toast?? j

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  Jeffrey_Grey on May 27 at 6:34 a.m.

  Gus,

  http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs257/en/

  It seems that the depleted uranium composing the penetrators in that kind of ammo isn’t all that heavy an emitter, as George correctly asserts. Indeed, as that article points out; DU is used as radiation *shielding* in certain applications.

  It’s not the ‘alphabet rounds’ (‘AP-DU’) that are going to get you, unless you’re unfortunate enough to actually get hit by one. (And even then, it’s the massive trauma that’ll do you in long before you have to worry about the radiation exposure - those big, heavy rounds are devastating.)

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  Jeffrey_Grey on May 27 at 9:43 a.m.

  George,

  One nit-pick: don’t discount North Korea’s submarines. The status of their submarine fleet - like most other aspects of the North Korean military - are the subject of a lot of guess work. However the current best-guess says that though the four-or-so Whiskey-class boats are probably laid up un-serviceable, some percentage of their twenty-two-or-so Romeo-class boats are probably sea/combat worthy. And though they don’t pose a credible blue-water threat, well crewed and well deployed, they could pose a genuine littoral threat. (A well managed diesel-electric sub operating in littoral waters is an ASW nightmare.)

  Same with their fleet of ‘brown water’ light-combatants. Not so much because of technical prowess (the North Korean navy is anything but high-tech) but rather because they would be operating in an arena that favors them.

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  lewis8457 on May 27 at 9:59 a.m.

  One Dirty bomb detonated above New York will send us back to the 1800’s.

  Apparently, the military has known about this since the 50’s but the electronics of today are more vulnerable to dirty bombs.

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  Jeffrey_Grey on May 27 at 11:46 a.m.

  Lewis,

  Point of information: if I’m reading your comments correctly, I think you’re confusing a dirty bomb with an EMP burst weapon.

  A dirty bomb is a conventional explosive jacketed in radioactive material. The weapon does not detonate at either an atomic or a nuclear level. Rather the conventional blast scatters the radioactive material over a large area thus rendering it uninhabitable. This is a relatively low-tech weapon of mass destruction. (Hitler was seriously considering employing such a device against New York in the wanning days of WW-II. He just lacked a dependable method of delivery.) The only special requirement for creating such a weapon is access to a sufficiently large stockpile of radioactive material. It doesn’t even have to be fissile. Anything ‘dirty’ will work. The dirtier the better.

  On the other hand, an EMP burst weapon - the kind of thing that would wipe out electronics and plunge us back into the 19th century, at least technologically - is a far greater technological challenge. For such a weapon to be effective, it would have to be a nuclear device lofted to near-earth-orbit altitudes. To my knowledge and for at least for the foreseeable future (though I might stand to be corrected on this), the only nations possessing both the type of warheads needed and the heavy-lift launch capability for lofting them are the United States, Great Britain, France, Russia and perhaps China. It should also be mentioned that there is *a lot* of speculation (and increasingly heated debate) as to just what effect such a device would actually produce were it to be deployed. There have been no specific tests of such a thing. The only evidence available is anecdotal data resulting from some of the last above-ground nuclear testing in the 50’s and 60’s.

  Now I want to be very clear that none of this is to suggest that your fears aren’t both reasonable and rational. Especially when it comes to dirty bombs, your fears are very reasonable. I think it’s just important to make sure you’re directing your concerns toward real threats.

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  George_Sands on May 27 at 12:24 p.m.

  They used to levy the specification on the AWACs that it had to be “nuclear” hardened in the event of a nuclear blast. That meant the coffee pots, the refrigerators and restrooms too. It was sort of a joke that if a Nuclear blast went off near an airplane, that worrying about whether the avionics worked was real low down on the list of worries, right below keeping the airplane flying and so what if all your fighters got blasted. Even the ash trays were grounded….back in the day.

  EMP is a big worry. A big enough one and all your solid state devices no longer work. Computers, computer chips in cars, Power grids, traffic lights, tv’s etc. etc. Thats why I still have a 72 VW..still has its transistor radio in it.

  EMP’s were on the same level as Particle beam weapons. “you gotta be close”.

  Remember the low yield enhanced radiation bombs that were bandied about? Didn’t destroy anything just radiated people bad enough to kill them w/o taking out the infra-structure.

  Some of the stuff I sat in on, was right out of Dr. Strangelove, it was often hard to constrain ones laughter.

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  lewis8457 on May 28 at 12:41 a.m.

  Thank you for the clarification Jeffery i know very little of such things. That is why i live close to FairChild when the big blast comes i want to be real close to the blast zone.

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  Jeffrey_Grey on May 28 at 6:57 a.m.

  Lewis,

  I just want to make it clear that there was no ‘dig’ intended in my clarification. As I say, your fears of a dirty bomb are well founded. I think if America is ever hit by a WMD; first - it’ll be the result of a terrorist attack and second - it’ll either a dirty bomb or a biological weapon. Neither of those require a significant technological base to deploy. The old ‘Yellow Ryder Truck’ delivery system would work just fine.

  Personally, I think an EMP weapon is a fairly unlikely threat because it requires such a significant technological base to deploy. It’s just not a ‘terrorist weapon’. Furthermore, the people who might theoretically deploy such a weapon against us would therefore, by definition, have every bit as much to lose themselves from our inevitable ‘retaliation in kind’.

  As for living near Fairchild… I agree with the logic.

  Everybody has to die of something. And if it’s a question of surviving to suffer in the wake of a large-scale nuclear exchange or being instantaneously transformed into a glowing cloud of plasma…

  I’ll take the latter.

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