Bad News: “A systemic failure has occurred”

30 comments on this post so far. Add yours!

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 11:43 a.m.

  Until such time that Obama is willing to define the enemy, how can he even begin to defend against the enemy?

  Yesterday, Obama termed Abdulmutallab “an isolated extremist.”

  http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/editorials/on_planet_janet_sNrAqiRNKUbjnNnxFUYhoL

• 

  Kage_Mann on December 30 at 12:08 p.m.

  According to the Detroit bomber, there are 25 more isolated extremists ready to terrorize America. It doesn’t sound isolated to me.

• 

  ejs on December 30 at 12:40 p.m.

  I wonder how long hmo sat at his computer waiting for this one to come up.

• 

  Charlie on December 30 at 2:49 p.m.

  Flight 253 seems to be turning out for Obama like GWB’s Katrina, slow to respond with a weak message. Time to put the PC junk away and start stepping on these cockroaches.

• 

  idawa on December 30 at 2:53 p.m.

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 3:41 p.m.

  Charlie. Obama is not doing himself any favors, in the way he is handling this whole matter. Not many are going to approve of the way this ENTIRE event has been dealt with.

• 

  idawa on December 30 at 4:03 p.m.

  Oh please, Obama has handled this far better than the previous admin would have and about as well as could be expected … it is sad (interesting) watching the right try to spin this into some referendum on Obama. I couldn’t imagine Bush taking any accountability for an incident like this and Cheny would probably be hiding behind such nonsense such as “criticizing our intelligence only emboldens the enemy”- type malarky. Or, more likely, they would be all over this as a PR-boon to their “War on Terror.” It is quite refreshing to see some thought about the state of the world for a change from our head guy.

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 4:22 p.m.

  idawa >> “Obama has handled this far better than the previous admin would have and about as well as could be expected”

  Wasn’t awaken to be told about for 3 hours. Waits three days to make a comment and does so in an open shirt. After saying he would be doing everything to curtail these ‘isolated etremists’ attacks, he then got back to his golf game. So, Janet carries the ball and fumbles on her ‘system worked’ comments. Then, had to retract that the next day and say it was a failure. Then Obama comes back out to address the problem. In the mean time, this plane bomber guy SHOULD not have been able to get on a plane. He was 86’d in England and couldn’t have flown out of there. Then we find out, these new al quada ‘extremists’ are from Yemen. And, 80 prisoners on the bubble with Gitmo are from there. We are still at war, folks, whether Obama admits it or not. Prisoners of war are held til the end of the conflict. The Ft. Hood terrorist had ties to the same groups. That is a hotbed for this stuff. AND, idawa, you tell me he has handled this well?? Your idea of ‘well’ and my idea of ‘well’ must be two different things.

• 

  idawa on December 30 at 4:35 p.m.

  HMO - you might have more credence if you didn’t cry Obama-wolf all the time. Sure, he could have predicted the specific attack himself by ferreting out all the details from his 30,000 ft level briefing, flown to Amsterdam on x-mas, found the guy in the security line, and beaten the sh(* out of him personally before he got on the plane, and yet I doubt you would be satisfied. To be clear, your two lead off issues were that he wasn’t woken up in time and he didn’t where a tie, gimme a break. But that’s right, chalk it up to one more instance of his incompetence, blah, blah, blah.

• 

  Charlie on December 30 at 4:36 p.m.

  IMO, Obama and his administration is being measured by the “terrorists” for a swarm of attacks anyplace an American has trod. OBL and his ilk have continued perfecting their formulas for attack and they don’t mind using their own as delivery devices, like children. They must be stopped dead in their tracks otherwise this continues for centuries. The Jews aand Arabs have been at each others throats for God know how long, do we want that?

• 

  Arch_Druid on December 30 at 4:37 p.m.

  And how long did it take GW to respond to 9/11/2001, Hmoffsuite? How long did it take GW to respond to Katrina? Obama being on Holiday vacation at the time the ATTEMPTED attack occurred, you might want to consider that he wasn’t going to comment until he knew what the facts are.

  On the other hand, heard this on CNN today, FORMER VP Cheney basically makes the same argument that you do. He does nothing but attack, scream and criticize at every turn. My response is as follows, if Cheney wanted to remain a political influence then he should have run for the Oval Office himself. Because he RETIRED, then he should simply shut up. As it is, he keeps alive for the majority of the American people all that went wrong with the prior administration and its particular failures, all of which were brought out again on CNN.

  And by the way, weren’t systematic intelligence failures the SAME argument post 9/11/2001? And how long did it take for the GW administration try to resolve that with a Homeland Security addition to the Washington, D.C. bureaucracy? Apparently, some 6 years later, it is STILL taking a long time to get the bugs worked out.

  Do yourself a favor, Hmoffsuite and think for awhile.

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 4:47 p.m.

  Arch >> “And by the way, weren’t systematic intelligence failures the SAME argument post 9/11/2001?”

  The point is that we learned a lesson from 9/11 or should have. Bush had to start from scratch building security, immediately. Obama had an infrastructure handed to him. 9/11 WAS the wake up call. Bush, btw, took a call on the phone immediately when 9/11 happened. Had Obama put the proper people in place, this situation would have been handled better. He took it too casually and probably still does.

• 

  eagleeye on December 30 at 5:00 p.m.

  I cant believe Obama made a comment with an open shirt. At least when Bush and Cheney lied to us they had the class to put on a tie !

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 5:01 p.m.

  Arch >> Do yourself a favor, Hmoffsuite and think for awhile.

  You don’t need to make comments of that sort. We went through that this weekend. State your case and leave it at that, ok?

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 5:10 p.m.

  eagleeye. In my mind, it is a matter of assigning a proper significance to an event.

• 

  eagleeye on December 30 at 5:16 p.m.

  Well, I think you are wrong.

• 

  Phaedrus on December 30 at 5:26 p.m.

  – does so in an open shirt.

  If you don’t wear a tie the terrorists win! This is laughable.

  Obama had an infrastructure handed to him.—suite

  Yeah, the one that Bush allegedly built during the past 8 years and it apparently still sucks, or maybe you don’t understand what the word systematic means?

  —Bush, btw, took a call on the phone immediately when 9/11 happened.—suite

  Yeah and then read a children’s book for how long?

  —He took it too casually and probably still does.—suite

  Yeah, lets get tough like the Bush/Cheney administration and assign a color to this, that’ll teach them!

• 

  Arch_Druid on December 30 at 5:28 p.m.

  Hmoffsuite, first of all, I don’t think we HAVE learned much since 9/11/2001 as we should have. As long as you persist in making this a political contest obviously you aren’t going to do much thinking. And yes, I did state my case. On the other hand, what have you accomplished beyond persistent whining that your party is now in a minority status?

  Didn’t catch the fellow’s name who went on CNN’s “The Situation Room with Wolf Blitzer” to immediately rant that we hadn’t had another terrorist attack on American soil during the rest of the GW administration. Technically true. However, terrorist attacks ELSEWHERE escalated, against American citizens and our allies across the world. Therefore, the fellow ranting also said a great deal in misleading statements. GW never stopped terrorism in Afghanistan. He didn’t wage a SMARTER war against terrorism after playing the game of oneupmanship where his own father was concerned in Iraq. And yes, the people behind the FOILED airline bombing attempt on Yule Day some of whom had spent time in Gitmo and were released in 2007.

  Should Obama be criticized for decisions made by the last administration? Should Obama come under legitimate scrutiny? Even Democratic strategist Robert Zimmerman thought so. In any case, this administration has now demonstrated far more openness than the last one and for that reason invites scrutiny. It is going to take the necessary oversight to manage to prevent any more wannabe jihadists from operating freely.

  I should think that this issue shouldn’t be placed in a political “gotcha” moment as much as you’d like it to do otherwise. Real Americans were in danger here. Is that a moot point Hmoffsuite in your zeal to go off the deep end because it is a Democrat in office instead of a Republican? Wonder why your fellow Americans aren’t as important as your all consuming desire to “get a Democrat?”

  That is precisely why I took issue with you over the week end. Terrorists simply do not care what party holds office in this country. When they strike is at a time of their own choosing. And either it is going to be an embarrassment for those in office to the utterly tragic and shocking.

  After all, Clinton took action soon after the first attempt on the World Trade Center. People like Clarke warned the GW administration REPEATEDLY and it was MONTHS before the GW administration began to take terrorism semi-seriously. Months too long to do the sort of repair on serious intelligence failures that precipitated 9/11/2001. So, why was the GW administration so lax on taking terrorism seriously?

  That’s not a question that Obama has to answer nor should you challenge him with the failures of the prior administration.

• 

  lew2nl on December 30 at 5:28 p.m.

  Why are we dickering about what the previous administration should have done? We should be concerned what has happened in the past few days and what WILL happen right now to stop further violent attempts. Many many people on this blog always view every event as political –— let’s do what people with common sense should do and forget the political aspects of who did and who didn’t do what. Let’s take care of insuring the safety of our country now. That’s my opinion.

• 

  Arch_Druid on December 30 at 5:35 p.m.

  No kidding, lew2nl. Did Obama run for Godhood? No. Which means that he isn’t omnipotent. And it takes incidents like this to change how we do business and correct for problems that did arise that allowed Mutallub to slip through the cracks.

  Hopefully, we begin getting things right.

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 5:38 p.m.

  This is not political. If Bush had handled this event in the same manner, I would be very critical of him as well. Or anyone else that sits where the buck stops.

• 

  Arch_Druid on December 30 at 5:55 p.m.

  Actually, Hmoffsuite, it had already been pointed out how the GW administration did not handle post 9/11/2001 IE what MIGHT have been done as to operational intelligence sharing. I bring to mind the following fact: On message boards (as they existed then where newspapers had set them up—such as the Washington Post) those of obviously GOP bias never thought to actually show criticism of GW because of the 9/11/2001 terrorist attacks at the WTC, Pentagon and etc. No, they were too busy jumping all over the LAST administration. They weren’t about the criticize their meal ticket to majority power. Not if they could apply a “weak on terrorism” canard against Democrats instead.

  You so sure of that? You would have indeed been JUST as critical of GW? Let’s put it bluntly, someone was on the ball that prevented the deaths of hundreds of people. That is to be applauded. Whereas, GW went on reading a children’s book to a classroom AFTER thousands of people had already died.

  The fact that hundreds of people did not die from the failed attack says that something did work. AND, Hmoffsuite, you want to nitpick how Obama responded. I have to disagree. We now have an opportunity to change what failed and hopefully improve on it. We should concentrate on that.

• 

  jt on December 30 at 6:31 p.m.

  Hmo, Arch, Mr. President - I find myself in the position of disagreeing with all of you.

  First, no plot was “foiled”. The idiot didn’t know how to properly detonate his crotch and when the passengers figured out he just tried to kill them all, well, they “controlled” the situation.

  “Systemic Failure” - first in the financial industry and now in national security? Give me a break. One has to have a functional system in order for there to be “systemic failure.”

  The Homeland Security Department was created, established and organized by an entirely Republican administration and Congress. And they have shown us just how well they do with actually running any organization which doesn’t line their pockets. Even now you have people like Jim DeMint holding up confirmation for the TSA leadership position because Senator DeMint is deathly afraid of unions. What is up with that?!? What is up with all these old white guys in the senate being so totally afraid of everything going on around them? Fear makes you stupid.

  What I’d like to see with regard to air travel security is a 180 degree about face. Every sane American citizen should be encouraged to board carrying weapons. I used to fly with my pocket knives and whatnot. Yes, things changed after Sept 11, 2001. No longer is passenger passivity an expectation. Disarming us only makes it harder for us to resist.

  /rant

• 

  hmoffsuite on December 30 at 7:06 p.m.

  jt. >> “Even now you have people like Jim DeMint holding up confirmation for the TSA leadership position because Senator DeMint is deathly afraid of unions. What is up with that?!?”

  Perhaps the republicans would like to see a little vetting for a position of this consequence. The Obama administration has had severe problems with that. Van Jones, Daschle,etc. And, what’s with the democrats trying to use this position to fulfill their social agenda? Payback to the unions for election time favors?

• 

  jt on December 30 at 7:23 p.m.

  That’s a big “perhaps” there hmo. Especially since the hold prevents the vetting process. A bit too much conspiracy theory via Glenn Beck. And don’t forget we can always name drop on the other side too. Anyone remember Bernie Kerik?

  How does allowing the nomination to move forward “fulfill their social agenda?” Don’t the workers have to vote the union in? And isn’t advocating a social agenda what happens when administrations change? Didn’t we get a bunch of industry, oil and mining guys running the Department of the Interior, EPA and similar agencies under Reagan and the Bushes? Didn’t we see the Consumer Protection Agency contract?

• 

  empyrius on December 30 at 7:52 p.m.

  Newsflash!

  You gluttonous oil-loving Americans: get out of the Middle East!

  Nuff said

• 

  fortboise on December 30 at 8:45 p.m.

  As jt says, fear makes you stupid. Absence of fear makes you complacent. We spin around the cycle.

  Dick Cheney pops up, is it Ground Hog Day already? He knows what’s possible, he knows we should be Very Afraid. So… which is scarier, the underpants bomber, or Dick Cheney?

  We were attacked on 9/11… so we focused all our attention and military power on deposing Saddam Hussein and occupying Iraq.

  Wait, what?

  Sorry, it’s just that the reach of Dick Cheney as terrorist was demonstrably greater than Reid or Abdulmutallab.

  Beyond politics, here’s the problem: we’ve built an advanced technological society based on significant trust in shared purposes. We trust that people driving cars on freeways don’t prefer Demolition Derby or suicide. That people who buy fertilizer and rent trucks don’t plan on blowing up buildings. That people using public transit systems want to go somewhere, rather than make a life (and death) statement. That our fellow humans are more or less rational.

  99.9999% or so of the time, that trust is well-placed.

  Careful, high-quality mechanical, electrical and civil engineering can often limit failures to less than 0.0001%, even in quite complex systems. (We’re not always willing to pay for that kind of reliability, though.)

  Social engineering, not so much.

  The problem with agreeing that this is “war,” is that it isn’t like anything else we’ve ever known by that name. Not that we should balk at that, really: war evolves with the rest of our technology.

  It *is* inarguably terrorism. Terrorism evokes fear. And so stupidity.

• 

  Phaedrus on December 30 at 9:50 p.m.

  “This is not political. If Bush had handled this event in the same manner, I would be very critical of him as well”—hmoffsuite

  Well, start criticizing, or admit to hypocrisy. Your choice.

  “Eight years ago, a terrorist bomber’s attempt to blow up a trans-Atlantic airliner was thwarted by passengers and revealed gaping holes in airline security only months after the Sept. 11 attacks.

  But President George W. Bush, then on vacation, made no public remarks for six days about the so-called shoe bomber, Richard Reid, and there were virtually no complaints from the media or Democrats that Bush’s response was sluggish or inadequate.”

  http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2010643179_airlineprez31.html

• 

  Me on December 30 at 10:43 p.m.

  I feel as comfortable now as I did in the last 8 years - which is not at all.

  The front door is guarded by 10 people and the back door is wide open. We will make people take off their shoes and pull their pant legs up and I won’t be allowed to have a book on my lap and all the while someone who has no luggage, a one way ticket and a Dad who is reporting them as being radical will walk right in that back door…..

  It has been like this since 9/11 - no CHANGE.

• 

  Arch_Druid on January 02 at 11:49 a.m.

  I’ll definitely agree with you, Me, on your comments. As I posted before, we haven’t learned what we needed to or changed what we should have.

  vigilance against terrorism requires that we guard BOTH doors and ALL windows. And that would require international cooperation.

  Hopefully, we’ll begin to see that happen.

« Back to Huckleberries Online

• ›Scanner traffic