Huckleberries Online

Friday The 13th Wild Card — 2/13/09

Feb. 13, 2009 5:56 p.m. • 140 comments

In the news this evening, the Senate is expected to pass the bailout package with at least 60 votes after the House OK’d it earlier today (sans votes from Idaho lawmakers) here. The Buffalo plane crash killed a 9/11 widow who was active in anti-terror work here. Obama’s about to unveil a plan to stem the tide of foreclosures here. The Supreme Court learns that Justice Ginsburg’s cancer hasn’t spread here. And the Wild Card remains on the table …

140 comments on this post so far. Add yours!

toadman on February 13 at 10:34 a.m.
So, I keep hearing and reading about this upcoming blogfest in CDA. Is there a location, a time, a date, and a place set? If so, I haven’t seen it yet..

Also, I’ve heard tell via some secret messengers, that there’s a shadow Spokane HBO blog-meet-up of sorts next week. Could the person who sent me that info some time back, please re-send? You know who you are…

Thanks.
JeanieSpokane on February 13 at 10:37 a.m.
There is a sad detail coming out of the plane crash last night - Beverly Eckert, a prominent 911 widow, was one of the victims.
Joker on February 13 at 10:44 a.m.
I know Dan of the County drops by this site. Maybe he can give some insights on his victories as a Democrat. He must be so lonely and frustrated by his own party.
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 10:51 a.m.
Now I’m learning that the stimulus package, in its current form, will include up to $6 Billion for ‘home weatherization’. This is up from the $447 Milliion that congress had authorized for this purpose in the current budget year. That is a great idea that would pay for itelf in maybe 10 or 20 years. But, I thought we wanted to STIMULATE the economy. Wasn’t the purpose of this bill? The more I read about it, the disgusted I get with Obama, Pelosi and Reid. This whole thing is a bill of goods, not a good bill. Jmho, of course.
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 10:55 a.m.
the more disgusted I get … that is. (Plenty disgusted already.)
nic on February 13 at 10:57 a.m.
hmo - try to follow this formula

weatherized homes = cheaper utility bills
cheaper utility bills = money not given to the utility companies
money not given to the utility companies = money available to spend on other goods & services
money available to spend on other goods & services = money spent on other goods & services
money spent on other goods & services = ecenomic growth
ecenomic growth = stimulus

Therefore… weatherized homes = stimulus
nic on February 13 at 10:57 a.m.
Joker, you really should change your name to broken record.
keithincda on February 13 at 10:58 a.m.
You know one thing that bothers me about this stimulus package is that is has grown so large and the text form of it is so massive that the votes will be taken and none (or very very few anyway) Congressman and Senators will even read before voting for it.
The T.A.R.P. bill was the same way…..there should be a mandatory time period for not just lawmakers to read it but for the public….the ones who have to pay for the damn thing…to read it as well to fully comprehend what is contained in it.
toadman on February 13 at 11:05 a.m.
People are sooo worried about the SIZE of the stimulus bill. Well, from what I hear, it’s not the SIZE of the stimulus bill that counts, but how we use it, that matters…

see?

It’s only money…which means, it can’t buy happiness anyway. Happiness comes from within, man.
idawa on February 13 at 11:06 a.m.
gawd HMO - WE GET IT, you (like most conservatives) don’t think government spending is stimulus, we know you would have been happier with with tax cuts and another cheap money policy… but, simply repeating your opinion that you don’t think this will work will not make it go away. And simple repeating your disgust is not going to change anyone mind if they support it.
keithincda on February 13 at 11:06 a.m.
Your description is accurate Nic but for the average homeowner how much do you think that energy savings will be?
Will any savings be enough to outpace the rising cost of energy?
Is it going to amount to enough for someone to go out to a dinner at a local restaurant? maybe buy some lumber at Lowes to fix the deck? buy some paint at Sherwin Williams and paint the kitchen? or will people just pay off a credit card with it?
Will people have to pay for winterization and then get a tax credit or do we all get a chack and just get deiced how much winterization we’re goping to do to our homes?

Wonder how it will work…..
toadman on February 13 at 11:09 a.m.
Frankly, I’m looking forward to having my older home weatherized, it seriously is gonna save me loads of money. Right now, during the winter, we pay an average of almost $250 a month for heating our small two bedroom 1930s era home.

Does anyone know how I’ll be able to take advantage of it after it’s passed? Will there be vouchers or something?
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 11:10 a.m.
nic >>> “hmo - try to follow this formula

weatherized homes = cheaper utility bills
cheaper utility bills = money not given to the utility companies
money not given to the utility companies = money available to spend on other goods & services”

The ROI takes too long. Ok for future spending but not to stimulate the economy. So, the Govt spends lots of money on insulating homes, weatherizing etc and maybe even programmable thermostats. So, the homeowners saves maybe $20 or $50 bucks per month? And you think that is going to stimulate our economy? This is not a prudent sitmulus expenditure. This is just another example of the crap thrown in to the bill. CHANGE? Transparency? Broken promises on that one. Its all pathetic. And you Dems can take all the credit for it. All of it. (we don’t have short memories)
keithincda on February 13 at 11:10 a.m.
Toad, take off the rose colored glasses, dude. I don’t think most peoples concerns relate at all to where our happiness comes from. I agree with you 100% that happiness is choice people make but the massive size of this bill, with Congress’s record of oversight of any spending bill leaves all of us wide open for abuse of the process.
It has noting to do with “happiness” as I read the meaning in your post. it has to do with maximizing the value for the dollars that are spent.

Because they do have to be paid back someday….
toadman on February 13 at 11:14 a.m.
Let’s see, if my heating bill goes down from an average of $250 a month in the winter.. let’s say four months.. to about $100 a month.. that’ll take my yearly average down from about $150 a month (+/- $1800 a year) to about $75 a month (+/- 900 a year). That’s a savings, more or less, for me of around 900 a year. That’s another $75 bucks in my pocket per month. Sure, in the grand scheme of things, it’s not a giant jolt of cash, but it’s a buffer against being in the red, or having to decide between heat, and groceries, nonetheless.
idawa on February 13 at 11:14 a.m.
…and I would like to contest the assertion that congressman don’t read the bills that come to the floor. Knowing several people who spent time as senate staffers for Larry Craig and others, the congressmen are well briefed by the time they vote. Usually, the congressmen themselves have read most, if not all the bill, and they have been briefed by staffers who have devoted long hours reading and summarizing the bills for their congressmen. I would argue that it is a very rare occurrence when a congressman votes on a bill where at least 1 person on their staff has not read the entire bill. True, not every issue is debated, but the urban myth that congressmen don’t know what they are voting for is simply cover in the form of plausible deniable to tell the voter - they know what they are voting for.

Now, do they comprehend it, have they thought through all the ramification, etc? that is a different issue entirely.
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 11:21 a.m.
idawa. Speaking to the subject of your last post ….

http://cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=43478
toadman on February 13 at 11:28 a.m.
“Toad, take off the rose colored glasses, dude.” - Keith

But they really make me look cooler than I am, man…

;-)
idawa on February 13 at 11:29 a.m.
and Toad, what the conservative always leave out is the multiplier effect (which is odd since they always tout it when they are arguing for tax breaks…)? In this particular example, the government stimulate the economy by providing funds to weatherize. Those fund save Toad money on his heating bills, the work required produces jobs to employers who employee people to do the weatherization, the weatherization requires that manufacturers to increase production of materials needed, and so forth…

Of course, many conservative argue that the government is so inefficient that the waste in the spending would dwarf any gains from the multiplier and is therefor negative…

Or they argue that given the increase in deficits that any gains are illusory as they will have to be repaid later…Then again, those same criticisms could have been levied against Bush’s tax cuts as they increased the deficit and would therefore discount any multiplier we received, but they didn’t make that argument then, did they?
idawa on February 13 at 11:36 a.m.
I wasn’t arguing that each congressman had read every line, but from I know from people who have actually worked on the hill, every congressman’s “office” has read the entire bill and briefed their congress person. Heck, I know my tax law professor has already read half of it and it isn’t even her job…
DFO on February 13 at 12:02 p.m.
I’ve eliminated a post by Nic and a response by another commenter. Nic, a dig that involves an individual commenter’s economic status crosses the line. No big deal. But I didn’t let it stay b/c I’ve cautioned others about this same sort of thing re: the same individual.
nic on February 13 at 12:56 p.m.
Seriously dave? I wasn’t insulting his status. If anything, I was insulting my own.
nic on February 13 at 12:57 p.m.
So let me reprhase it.

hmo, an extra $20 or $50 bucks per month would benefit a lot of Americans.
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 1:05 p.m.
nic >>>”hmo, an extra $20 or $50 bucks per month would benefit a lot of Americans.”

Yes it would. However, it would do little to help stimulate the economy and give it the immediate jolt I thought a stimulus implied. That was the whole point.
Liz on February 13 at 1:49 p.m.
I am getting SO flippin’ tired of hearing about the woman with the eight babies…please..stop….
Arpie on February 13 at 2:52 p.m.
HMO people will have jobs doing all this weatherizing. More jobs, less energy used, more money to spend elsewhere. This is one of the parts of the plan I wish was bigger.
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 3:01 p.m.
I read on 43rd State Blues that Sisyphus received a death threat based on a post he did regarding Zeb Bell (the hate-radio guy from SE Idaho).

I realize that DFO isn’t much interested in Zeb, but methinks there are some NI readers of HBO who could offer very sound advice on dealing with hate groups, which Bell’s listenership is beginning to resemble.

Hopefully, Sis will be able to elaborate at some point.
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 3:09 p.m.
Arpie >> “HMO people will have jobs doing all this weatherizing.”

This will be a new government program. Just watch what happens. First they will need to study the task and have numerous committee meetings designing the rules, manuals, who and what applies, etc. Then determine the eligibiltiy requirements and method of measuring the need and who is entitled to the benefit. Then, likely get bids submitted for consideration and the have a significant ‘review’ process. By the time the money gets to the guy with the house that needs attention, most of the money will be gone. Thats right, sucked up into the workings of the government. As a stimulus, if it is not ‘shovel ready’, it will be a waste. Remember the old luxury tax that past several years ago? Going after those buying a car over 35 grand or a boat or something? The administration of the new tax cost more than the revenue it generated but nearly put the boat industry out of business in the meantime. In short and imo, weatherization of homes to the tune of 6 billion dollars is not the best place to put stimulus dollars.
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 3:16 p.m.
Weatherizating is not only stimulutive as Arpie and Toad have pointed out, it’s also crucial to Obama’s goal of energy independence.

Also, I believe that part of weatherizing will be identifying Republicans and installing the weatherization materials in such a way that’ll they’ll be unable to leave their homes, listen to talk radio or receive Faux News. imo
Sisyphus on February 13 at 3:38 p.m.
Wow he talks like Republicans are still in charge of FEMA or something.
Sisyphus on February 13 at 3:39 p.m.
“Shovel ready”—I’ll be so happy when that one hits the dust.
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 3:40 p.m.
Sis: Just keep your virtual shovel ready for some of the posts we can expect after the stimulus passes.
Bob on February 13 at 3:42 p.m.
Sisy, sorry to hear that about the threat. That can be scary stuff.
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 3:46 p.m.
Breaking: Betsy’s got a story on Nonwini now saying that his radical education bills may not be necessary. Because…

Wait for it…

Wait for it…

Money coming to Idaho from Obama’s stimulus bill.

http://www.spokesman.com/blogs/boise/2009/feb/13/nonini-school-cuts-ed-bills-may-not-be-necessary-after-all/
Sisyphus on February 13 at 4:01 p.m.
I don’t even know what the guy said exactly yet. But me blogging buddies deleted it and assured me of his intentions. When you go up against bigoted wing of the Republican party, there’s a tendency for them to be at a loss for words and go all postal. Its ok we know his name, where he lives and his contact information. He’s been sent to the thong. He just wants attention. Best not give it to him.

Ironic that it was related to this post.

http://www.43rdstateblues.com/?q=node/5745
Sisyphus on February 13 at 4:06 p.m.
Here’s the breakdown on Idaho’s cut. Do you think the Republicans in the statehouse will turn it away before they thank us for it?

http://www.idahostatesman.com/1306/story/667598.html
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 4:20 p.m.
nick >>”Weatherizating is not only stimulutive as Arpie and Toad have pointed out, it’s also crucial to Obama’s goal of energy independence”

Fine. I salute Obama’s goal of energy independence. The problem is that ….. I’ll speak real slow so you can hear what I am saying ……It is not an immediate solution to energize the economy. It can be done after the economy improves. If they lean on the automakers any more about cafe standards, etc, they will really mess things up. If energy independence really had any priority with Obama, he’d let us drill for oil. Or build nuke plants.
nic on February 13 at 4:37 p.m.
immediate solutions = fail

With no planning for long term inmpact, any attempt for an immediate solution style stimulus will be used immediately… creating a need for more immediate solution style stimulus. This is the failure logic that we’ve been working with for the last 8 years.

Future generations are the ones who will have to pay for this stimulus package, we must keep them in mind. If we want to fix the economy, we have to look at something that will have lasting impact.
hmoffsuite on February 13 at 4:46 p.m.
nic. First things first, is all I am saying. This economy situation is very, very bad with more shoes to fall. If not fixed immediately, there will be extreme damage done. The situation is acute and some desirable programs will simply have to wait.
Bent on February 13 at 5:20 p.m.
Hey Keith — based on avatars — I thought it was the poolman wearing rose-colored glasses
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 5:29 p.m.
HMO: Don’t patronize me. It is stimulative, plus actually takes into account other mid-range goals important to a healthier economy.

Obama has stated he’s supportive of both more domestic drilling and nuke power. Both will require a lot of legwork and don’t happen overnight given regulatory issues. Winterizing can happen almost immediately, given that most power companies (in fact, both Idaho Power and Avista) already have guidelines in place for approved winterization methods.

I’m sure that Republicans would love to have tiny, bite-sized bills everyday that they could snipe at. Aint gonna happen. Obama and the Democratic leadership are smart enough to deal with the big picture and the details. I know, it’s a hard concept after 8 years of Bush’s paint-by-numbers approach to the world.
thomg57 on February 13 at 6:09 p.m.
a dig that involves an individual commenter’s economic status crosses the line.

Wow, We’ve finally reached the nanny state on this blog. At least as far as one commenter is concerned. DFO, can you publish a list of the things we can’t say about He Who Must Not Be Criticized?
thomg57 on February 13 at 6:12 p.m.
It’s futile to discuss a topic with certain commenters who continually change the parameters of the conversation or move the target each time it gets hit. Waste of pixels. Spend Obama Spend!

BTW, Frank Henderson (R-Post Falls) was quoted in yesterday’s CdA Press as saying the funds coming to Idaho for highway infrastructure will —get this— “CREATE A LOT OF JOBS.”
Arch_Druid on February 13 at 6:25 p.m.
I figure someone had to have read the bill that Congress posted on the website. Some new out of nowhere GOP group for “American Prosperity” got on the CNN news channel and whine about global warming being a hoax and whaling away at green technology. Didn’t take long to suddenly form a group, get the money and put out an ad. Bet they disappear just as quickly.
Joker on February 13 at 6:28 p.m.
Hey ThomG:

I checked out the Kootenai County Democrats’ Web site. The newsletter is from December. It’s Feb. 13. What’s going with that/

I couldn’t find a list of who serves on the board. Does one exist?

The Web site looks very hokey and outdated. Lots of white space too. I know it can’t be as cool as the new White House web site, but couldn’t somebody round up a college kid with some computer skills to jazz up your site with some flash.

I encourage others to check it out.

http://www.kootenaidemocrats.com/

Then compare it to the local Republican site (it’s not much better than the Dems). http://www.kootenaigop.org

I thought the Dems were always on the cutting edge. What happened?
Joker on February 13 at 6:31 p.m.
Too bad the Dems didn’t have a candidate to challenge Frank Henderson last fall. I wonder why that is…. Oh well, it’s fun to keep on bashing old Henderson. Least he remembers the Great Depression…
thomg57 on February 13 at 6:40 p.m.
I’ve been commenting on this blog since 2006 and the Joker is my first ankle biter, I guess I’ve made the big time! DFO, what other tricks does your buddy perform?
Joker on February 13 at 6:44 p.m.
Nice dodge again. You shake and bake, but never answer questions. These aren’t ankle bites. They are legit questions. You’re refusal to answer them says a lot about you. I wonder what the higher ups in the Democratic party would say about your ability as chair? Maybe these shoes are too big for you.
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 6:53 p.m.
Compared to Nowini, Geodde, Chadderton and Phart, Henderson is a gem. He’s level-headed. He’s no knee-jerk, reactionary Republican. His age is only a factor if he starts slipping up or displays a lack of grasp on the issues. So far, no signs of either.

As a Democrat though, I’m worried about the Obama obsession by many Idaho Dems. He got 38%. That’s not a winning formula, imo. Unfortunately, many of his most active supporters have a very extreme litmus test when it comes to other Dems.

Maybe, if Obama saves the economy, delivers health care and manages to create some rural jobs, it could help some Idaho Dem candidates in two years. However, Minnick and his message (as much as I disagree with some of it), is a better message formula than Obama for North Idaho.
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 7:00 p.m.
Joker: The higher-ups in the IDP (Minnick excluded) are perhaps the least qualified people to judge Thomg’s effectiveness. From what I’ve seen, neither Keith Roark nor Jim Hansen could win a campaign if every Republican in Idaho was caught with, as Edwin Edwards put, “either a live boy or a dead girl”.
thomg57 on February 13 at 7:06 p.m.
They are legit questions—Joker

Post humping questions from an anonymous sock puppet? No, I don’t think so. Yesterday, I posted my phone number, if you have serious questions, criticisms, or suggestions, call me, I’d love to listen and then answer your questions. On here, not so much.
Arch_Druid on February 13 at 7:16 p.m.
I just updated my profile to now include my twitter and facebook account. You are all invited to converse.
zelda on February 13 at 7:23 p.m.
“Shovel ready” is the new “boots on the ground.”
Joker on February 13 at 7:25 p.m.
I have no desire to call you if you can’t even answer basic questions.

So much for Obama’s era of transparency. I guess you missed the Democratic memo. Or maybe it’s because you’re afraid for the world to see your answers.

See Nick, this is you’re local leader. Cowering in the light of reasonable questions.
Sisyphus on February 13 at 7:25 p.m.
Oh please Nick. Look at the questions. Joker’s shooting blanks, a task for which I’m sure he’s familiar. Nice new avatar, but a weak disguise.
Joker on February 13 at 7:27 p.m.
Maybe another Democrat can start answer these questions, paging Mike Kennedy, Dan English, George Sayler, anyone?
Arch_Druid on February 13 at 7:29 p.m.
Before Joker gets into accusing Obama of lacking openness and transparency, he could do some of that himself.
Joker on February 13 at 7:37 p.m.
I am not the chairman of the Kootenai County Democrats. He has a duty to answer questions about how his party and how he goes about his business.
Nick_Adams on February 13 at 7:41 p.m.
Joker: Keep trying, kid. I’m sure Thomg will be happy to open up the playbook because you’ve started posting on a blog.

You know, you could just replace Dem with Rep and post the same puddle-deep analysis on a blog in King County.
Bob on February 13 at 7:48 p.m.
Joker’s a spray troll. He just unzips his troll pants and starts spraying wildly and since he’s firing from a snub-nosed revolver (intellectual metaphor) he’s got little accuracy.

He’ll hump your shin today Thom, someone else’s tomorrow. He’s fancying himself a big Lib-killer now. Because he asks such *serious* questions.

It’s a carnival of hack with the Joker in the midway hustling troll dolls.

Anyhow Thom, be careful, Joker gets to fire off his wee wee pejorative gun without any suppression but if we are big MEANIE PIES to lil Joker we get deleted and threatened with the cooler.

Because that is how weak the game the cons have. They need special help.

Go Joker go!

LMAO
thomg57 on February 13 at 7:49 p.m.
He has a duty to answer questions about how his party and how he goes about his business.—Joker

Uh, no I don’t. you want a dialog, call me. You want to play your sock puppet game, feel free, but you’ll be playing alone, something at which you’re probably adept.
Bob on February 13 at 7:51 p.m.
By the way I just coined “spray troll” make sure to cite me appropriately. Especially if it gets a Wikipedia entry, Joker. :-)
Joker on February 13 at 7:55 p.m.
Nick,

Playbook? I think you’re giving ThomG and the others far too much credit.

I am talking about a web site that looks like it was designed in 1995. I am talking about election results or lackthereof.

Ask yourself this? Why do the Dems continue to lose election, or worse fail to even field a candidate?

I can’t place all the blame on Thom G and his fellow board members whoever they might be. It’s Idaho Democratic leadership. They keep trotting out the same tired candidates to run against Republicans and they keep losing, ie Larry LaRocco ritualistic drummings at the hands of Jim Risch.

I thought Howard Dean was brillant when he adopted the 50 state approach and pumped money into every state. Sadly, Dean left before he could take a long hard look at Idaho. Somebody needs to.
thomg57 on February 13 at 7:57 p.m.
I like spray troll. ;-)
Joker on February 13 at 8:08 p.m.
THat’s the best you got? Troll comments and a masturbation reference.

Can’t have a dialogue on a blog? What are you so afraid of?

If you can’t win a debate on a blog, how can you expect to win an election? Oh wait, you don’t. You’re in the concession business, next time the Republicans win an election, you’ll be there to give them an ice cream cone and big fat sloppy kisses.

In the last general election in Kootenai County here is the evidence of surrender:

Jim Clark, Republican. — unopposed by the Dems.
Phil Hart , Republican — unopposed by the Dems.
Bob Nonini, Republican — unopposed by the Dems.
Frank Henderson, Republican — unopposed by the Dems.
Jim Hammond, Republican – unopposed by the Dems.
Mike Jorgenson, Republican — unopposed by Dems.

Did I miss anybody?
OrangeTV on February 13 at 8:13 p.m.
Joker, you think that’s an ugly and outdated website, try these:

http://www.republicans-bonner-county.com/

http://benewahdemocrats.org/

http://www.latahgop.com/

http://www.latahdemocrats.org/

So what? Obviously, these types of organizations frequently don’t have a lot of budget money spend on slick web design. What does that have to do with anything,really?
Stickman on February 13 at 8:17 p.m.
Gee, I sometimes wonder why I fail to comment anymore. I guess this thread makes my case. Sorry.
Me on February 13 at 8:20 p.m.
Whooo Whooo - I’d like to interrupt this little blog orgy to bring you the great news that we all got to pay to fly the senator casting the deciding vote to pass the stimulus package tonight!!!

So happy. I LOVE when we do things like this - it makes my piddling little bit of money that I make look like nuthin. I know it was a “small government plane” but probably cost more than I made this month or maybe this year. But at least we got the bill passed.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/02/13/brown.stimulus.vote.flight/
Stickman on February 13 at 8:20 p.m.
I will see some of you at the blogfest. I am coming because I know many of you from long ago and miss you. Simple.
Bob on February 13 at 8:27 p.m.
OTV, don’t you know that so many people decide on their candidates and party affiliations because of cool websites as opposed to, you know, personal belief systems or personal self interest. It’s teh internest!

Those are seriously horrid. But I love the photo of the Idaho Rethuglicans (Sali et al) on the Boner County GOP page. Particularly Sali with his weirdly stiff arms jutting out like he’s some sort of robot.

And is it just me or does Bill Sali always have a facial expression in photos like he just made a dirty in his pants and he’s slightly befuddled yet happy about it?
Joker on February 13 at 8:35 p.m.
OTV, it’s true those sites are horrid. No doubt.

Obama revolutionalized politics with his use of the series of tubes called the Internet. He raised records amount of dough with an interactive web site. It was awesome.

You’d think our local Dems would learn something from Obama and try to build a better site. I realize they don’t have tens of thousands of dollars, but I bet they could recruit some college kids and I bet they could find a person or two who knows something about computers.

Bob loves to rip subpar web sites, yet he is blissful silent on KCD’s web site.

P.S. Bob, Bill Sali probably did make a dooty in his pants when they snapped the picture. You made a funny. Good one.
Joker on February 13 at 8:38 p.m.
I love the December news letter picture of ThomG. Reminds me of my favorite disney characters.

When does the newsletter for March go up? I bet in July. We should start a pool and the winner gets a free cold one.
Bob on February 13 at 8:44 p.m.
Joker, it’s fun to watch you try to be a big boy and a real whipsmart maven of cyber politics, but again, and this is quite a theme of yours, = FAIL.

Trying to miniaturize the Obama national sensation to Kootenai Co and expect a similar netroots effect is beyond stupid, it’s positively Sali. It’s you making a poo in your pants right here. You don’t understand the demographics of the netroots. Not even close.

A super hot Kootenai Co Dem site isn’t gonna get crap. It’s a nonstarter. But please, keep arguing for it. It’s way too fun to watch.
thomg57 on February 13 at 8:45 p.m.
Joker, newsletters are quarterly, would you like me to email you a copy?
Joker on February 13 at 9:06 p.m.
Bob,

It’s funny, somebody associated with the Kootenai County Democrats decided to use Act Blue as the fundraising mechanism on their site. Act Blue, according to wikipedia, is a highly sophisticated online fundraising mechanism. Act Blue doesn’t take any cut of the money it collects and it raised millions of dollars for Dems across the country. So, you basically don’t have a clue what your talking about.

If they can use a great fundraising tool, why can’t they update their web site. You know it projectile vomits all over the place.

The fact is you believe Idahoans can’t elect Dems because you depict them as morons who couldn’t find their arse with two hands and a map.

Thom,

A quarterly newsletter. Why not every month? Quarterly is so weak. No, I can find it on the web site. I don’t need you to email it. Ever thought about regular online updates.

I loved all four pictures of the Washington D.C. trip. Four pictures that’s it. The crowning moment in history and all you got were four pictures? Are there more I am missing?

Keep telling yourself I am a troll with nothing to say. I will keep watching the Dems lose in Kootenai County. The good news is you’re making progress!
Bob on February 13 at 9:25 p.m.
Joker, I grow weary of patting you on your pointy top pinhead and trying to get you to zip it before you make a bigger mess. But you won’t listen and it’s kinda fun to watch you flail.

NOBODY WILL LISTEN TO THE JOKER!

The internets will save Kootenai Co. Democrats. Sure.

As to my beliefs, I expect democrats will regain control of Koot Co when the following happens (and none includes a super sexy web site for chrissakes LOL)

1. Kootenai Co becomes more racially/ethnically diverse.
2. Repeat 1.

As an aside, electing a wingnut DINO like Walt Minnick, while he’s certainly an improvement over Sali, in fact electing a bullhead catfish named Catfish Henry would have been an improvement, isn’t really the plan to regain Demo power.

Certainly nothing like getting a mining company to send some goons out to beat the hell out of some muckers trying to organize a union. Sigh. Those days are long gone.
thomg57 on February 13 at 9:26 p.m.
Keep telling yourself I am a troll with nothing to say.-Joker

If you insist.
Escapee on February 13 at 9:29 p.m.
1. Sometimes reading this blog is akin to neighbors yelling at each other over the backyard fence.

2. Republicans seem to want Obama to fail.

3. That’s all.
Bob on February 13 at 9:32 p.m.
Boy that encapsulates the last several weeks, Escapee. Nice job condensing.
Joker on February 13 at 9:52 p.m.
Holy Cripes Bob.

That’s a pretty bleak forecast for the Dems. Idaho is, what 98 percent white. It might take decades for those numbers to change. Major downer dude for those blue backers.

I wonder if your ballsac brigade (ThomG and Sis) share that view?

Is there a plan B?
Kage_Mann on February 13 at 10:30 p.m.
Bobby, why don’t you write a childrens book called: ‘Stacy the Unicorn Horse’ and donate the proceeds to the North Idaho Democratic Party, to help ThomG out. Gawd knows he needs help.You could even go on a book tour to all the grade schools in the area, to sell your little Novelette.
Kage_Mann on February 13 at 10:40 p.m.
ThomG,I think you have to study how as a Democrat, Cecil Andrus was able to win 4 terms as Governor.Also, if the demos
keep insisting on having libs run for office in Idaho, they will lose almost everytime.Maybe, ya need to think outside the box?
Think.
Joker on February 13 at 10:59 p.m.
Ok, I am going to try and take a break from dropkicking Bob, ThomG, and Sis around the ring this weekend. I won’t make false promises that I won’t jump into the squared circle if things get nutty. I’ve been warned by my HBO supporters (of which their numbers are growing every day) to not burn myself out. I must admit giving clothesline after clothesline can get a little dull.

So, be nice Kage, these boys got the stuffing beat out of them the last couple of days. ThomG got piledriven into the mat pretty hard, I think his neck hurts.

Rest up boys, cause next week you’re going to need it.
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 6:16 a.m.
This morning, I reread the entire thread. Joker wins. Hands down.
Bob on February 14 at 7:25 a.m.
I see poor Joker needs to take some extra sleeping pills and rest up this weekend after the mocking he took by several of us last night. Maybe he will work on a new website! Make sure to post the link, Joker.

Kage, nice to see you back. I guess you didn’t take a break to get any smarter but hey, that’s what we love about you, your unremitting failure to be brighter than a refrigerator bulb.

*stretches*

Apparently the handicapping continues to make HBO more conservative-easy, more like those noncompetitive games the hippies invented back in the early 70’s where nobody had to lose! — Thawtful got banned last night. Let’s see Thom was banned earlier in the week, I was threatened with it for responding to Joker’s constant spew of Bobsession. And now Thawtful. Hmmmm.

I think when the dust settles there will be Sisyphus and a gaggle of honking wingnuts. Fortunately, it still won’t be a contest. But if Sisy gets banned, then this place could be a heavenly echo chamber for wingnuts where they can scratch each others matted back hair and pick each others troll boogers and jump up and down grunting and boxing at shadows.
Arpie on February 14 at 8:33 a.m.
HMO,
Can you explain to me why conservatives are so dead set against conserving? To me, wetherstripping and CAFE standards ring a lot more prudent than drill baby drill. We may have to drill anyway, but shouldn’t we do everything we can to use less first? Isn’t that the conservative thing to do?
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 9:00 a.m.
Arpie. I can’t speak for all conservatives. I can only offer my views which would likely be considered to be conservative. I think weatherstripping, green cars and all efforts along those lines are a good thing and necessary in the long run. But, due to circumstances, we need fixes in the short term. More immediate. The time it would take for a return on investment for the weatherization causes it to be a phase II type endeavor, imo. To increase the CAFE standards for autos is a good thing also but with the automakers facing their bleak futures, now is not a good time to be raising the bar. As I have said before, it would be like putting on the brakes while trying to go up a hill. This automaker situation will come to light again this week and it will be just another huge problem for the economy. Obama is deeply indebted to the labor unions and will try to save them as best he can. Problem is that with the unions in place, the automakers don’t have a viable business model. Huge job losses will likely occur regardless of the resolution for the industry. Conservation is, indeed, a good thing and necessary.
Dennis on February 14 at 9:25 a.m.
HMO,

I don’t blog and I just blurk on an irregular basis, however, I do check this site on a regular basis and put in my 2 cents on subjects I feel strongly about.

Your response to Arpie was the most lucid, well thought out response I have seen you post since you came over here. Please stick to writing your thoughts rather than regurgitating Hannity, Limbaugh or Faux News. It’s your opinion that generates debate, not the propaganda machines.

Some of the points you make, I agree with you. Others I don’t. I think everyone is looking for that perfect suit in this off the rack times. We all need to slow down, “THINK” this thing through, evaluate “ALL” viable options and put in place a real recovery plan.

This mad rush to spend will not benefit anyone. JMHO
Sisyphus on February 14 at 9:47 a.m.
“I think when the dust settles there will be Sisyphus”—don’t count on it. I think Dave allowing trolls to take over the site demeans it and will render it to the oblivion such a site deserves. I don’t mind Joker’s uninvested swiping against Democrats and their failures in North Idaho, or all of Idaho, even though that’s painfully obvious. But simply repeating it constantly and gloating each time without any semblance of creativity is churlish. But worse is allowing the repeated personal attacks against a poster, not anonymous, and the aspects of his job gets very personal beyond the letter and spirit of the rules that used to make this a reasonable place, particularly by an anonymous poster who has no personal stake it is willing to put forth. I take an occasional swipe at Dave for his editorializing but if I sat here and repeatedly chastised his career failures, how embarrassingly rudimentary the new website is, or ridiculed his personal appearance I’m thinking I wouldn’t last long. Constantly asking other posters for factual basis for the plethora of misinformation they post also makes for unproductive tedium despite the perfect allegory it provides for how the country got to where it is. The simplicity of the repetion is quite reminiscent of the Orwellian pablum on the one way mediums controlled by Murdoch. If that’s the goal then bleat away. Its a waste of the new medium. It just confirms the arguments my blogging brethren say against this place, an argument in which I’d no longer be a willing participant.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 9:48 a.m.
Looks like things got a little nasty here while I was away Twittering and Facebooking. Dudes, like Joker and etc. Set up Googletalk and gmail me at Archdruid2@gmail.com and I’ll be more than happy to take the heat off the Dems on this blog. I truly love to take whacks at the new left radicals which you dudes do represent. Or you can even sign up at Twitter and search out Arch_Druid and take your vicious swipes there too. So that the next time you come on to HBO, maybe you’ll learn to be a bit more civil the way good Christians should be. As it is, I find nothing moral or very “Christian” in your arguments.

As for the “stimulus package.” Hey think about this, Hmoffsuite, would you like to know why the auto companies are suffering? It has nothing to do with the unions and everything to do with foreign competition. Automakers out of Japan and Germany, where oil has to be imported and the price of gas is higher there than here in this country, were also the first countries to come up with fuel efficient cars. So people took to buying those when the auto companies decided to use Congress to crush the CAFE standards. Because the big 3 didn’t want to compete, they lost the cutting edge technology for improving autos to foreign companies such as Toyota and etc. And then they began losing customers as gas prices skyrocketed to Toyota and etc. They have only themselves to blame for being two miles behind the curve on improved technology.
Sisyphus on February 14 at 9:49 a.m.
Agreed Dennis.
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 9:55 a.m.
Dennis. Just so you will know, I happen to get the majority of my news and information directly from the newswire as it comes across the wire. I have a service that provides the AP, Reuters, Dow Jones wire, and several more feeds. As I read news accounts, I form my own opinions and often post them here. I do not listen to Hannity, Rush or anyone else. If my opinions are similiar to theirs, it is simply a coincidence. As a daytrader, I am in front of my computers the majority of the weekday and absorb the news in real time. I subscribe to the newswire service merely to gain a trading advantage for stocks, if news breaks on a company I trade in.
Sisyphus on February 14 at 9:56 a.m.
I’d be interested to know which sponsored legislation incorporated those concepts.
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 10:03 a.m.
arch >> “Hmoffsuite, would you like to know why the auto companies are suffering? It has nothing to do with the unions and everything to do with foreign competition.”

To a large degree, it IS the unions that prevent the companies from competing with the foreign competition. And, it isn’t just the hourly wages.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 10:04 a.m.
I get the impression that Hmoffsuite being a daytrader doesn’t think that there is much profit to be made in weatherization of homes or green technology in autos. To put it bluntly, the research and development of the latter would call for the hiring of trained techies and scientists to come up with better engines and power supplies. As for weatherization, you have to purchase the materials to retrofit scads of homes. How about moving some of your daytrading expertise into the companies that can provide that sort of material? Or is this a matter of HMO himself being unable to think outside the box?
keithincda on February 14 at 10:04 a.m.
I’ve said this before not long ago….a lot of the left on this blog constantly vomit the old line “quit repeating Hannity/Rush/Oreilly talking points” to some of the conservative posters here. Kage is the only one I have ever seen admit he listens to any of them.
I’m like HMO, I work all day in front of a computer and talking on the phone benefiting from our shrinking capitalist economy doing what I do. I don’t have time, let alone the interest to listen to talk radio. But the left sure know what those guys have said…seems to me they listen to them more than anyone else on here….
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 10:12 a.m.
arch >> ” get the impression that Hmoffsuite being a daytrader doesn’t think that there is much profit to be made in weatherization of homes or green technology in autos.”

Quite to the contrary. I have my ‘Obama’ plays that I trade. Stem cell research companies and solar power are a couple of good sectors. Hydrogen fuel cells is another, fwiw. The problem is that these comanies require huge amounts of cash to fund their research and profits are way out there. Stocks trade on earnings largely and not entirely on promises and blue sky. These green ideas are good but until they become commercially viable and cost effective, they are questionable investments. Don’t think I am not paying attention.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 10:13 a.m.
The unions don’t set auto standards, Hmoffsuite. That’s the job of the corporate execs. The unions did not lobby to reduce the CAFE standards, that was what the corporate execs did. All the unions wanted was wages, benefits and pensions. The corporate execs were the ones who decided not to compete with foreign auto makers and make the sort of mousetrap that the customer base would prefer to buy. My family for one gave up on Fords and etc. built by the big 3 because they tended to break down and in general not run well. I have a 20 odd year old Isuzu that I can still trust to take out on the road and doesn’t require that much maintenance. The unions did not create a piece of junk at inflated prices and put it out on the roads for people to try to drive, find it breaks down repeatedly in a couple of years, and ultimately trade it in for another piece of junk at inflated prices. No, that’s what the corporate execs chose to do. If the unions ran the big 3, only then can you blame them for the mess the big 3 now find themselves in. That is not the case.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 10:17 a.m.
Good of you to be paying attention, Hmoffsuite. These companies require a lot of investment, so very true. Which is what a good part of that stimulus package that’s got the GOP so hopping mad in Congress is designed to do. Provide an investment. So it isn’t a government contract to rebuild Iraq or to put out yet the latest in military toys, something that also requires a gvt investment of yours and my tax dollars. But if we are to gain the energy independence, it is a necessary and immediate investment.
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 10:20 a.m.
Arch. If you were to go out and buy a new car from the big 3, you would be amazed at the quality of automobile that is being produced. This isn’t the 70’s anymore. The cars are as good as any built anywhere in the world. So, get off the ‘lousy product’ argument. And, current big 3 gas stats are better than most other companies. Do some research. The problem with the unions, quite frankly, it their “Work Rules”. It is a bigger problem to the automakers than the inflated wages their union members receive. If a paint sprayer on a line clogs, an assembly worker can’t get out a piece of wire and clean it, no. They have to call the guy from the painters union and shut the line down for an hour while they retreive the worker from his checkers game. That sort of thing is more detrimental to the automakers ability to compete than, again, frankly, wages.
Bob on February 14 at 10:23 a.m.
Well, my advice to DFO would be to stop insulting his cons by trying to make this place a hellhole for progressives by banning and deleting them while simultaneously encouraging his cons and new attack poodle to snap away, and to quit using (and failing) with proxies and step up and let his conservative bona fides shine through.

Post more editorials, more right wing talk radio type posts. It will draw in cons like robot moths to an arc welder flame and inflame the progressives who will either split or increase their impassioned arguments and posts and make this place just hum with teh smart.

The heavy hand of Bloggermental intervention, as is being practiced, is a dumbulus package that will turn this place into a CDA Press-grade blog. It’s already gaining a bit of that crazed and stupid feel.

Like it or not, the lefties here are the most clever, creative, erudite and grown up among the politically obvious commenters.

Sisyphus vs. Kage Mann doesn’t exactly summon fond comparisons to the old John Kenneth Galbraith vs William F. Buckley debates now does it?

Let the free idea market rule here. And quit wiping the dirty bottoms of your conservative toddlers Mr. DFO, they need to learn to use that roll of TP themselves.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 10:26 a.m.
A daytrader knows all about what goes on in unions? A daytrader knows all about manufacturing autos? How do you know that those work rules you snipe at aren’t in part set up by the corporate execs themselves? If the paint sprayer gets clogged and if the dude operating it does something wrong in trying to unclog it, I expect something would get shut down for a lot more than an hour to repair the damage. If that happened often enough, then what you were complaining about would probably make sense. LOL!
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 10:28 a.m.
Arch >> “Which is what a good part of that stimulus package that’s got the GOP so hopping mad in Congress is designed to do. Provide an investment”

You make my point. The stimulus package is supposed to Stimulate, not be a long term investment. And, yes, that is what gets us so hopping mad. What part of the word ‘stimulus’ are you having trouble grasping?
keithincda on February 14 at 10:40 a.m.
Joan>>>”A daytrader knows all about what goes on in unions? A daytrader knows all about manufacturing autos?”

Joan you work in big box retail, therefore you have superior knowledge? Anybody can research this stuff just like you obviously have. What does some ones vocation have to do with their ability to formulate their opinions after their own research? Since they differ from yours you have to call into question how he’d know anything based on his way he makes a living?

That’s kind of elitist isn’t it?
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 10:41 a.m.
Let me see, where to start: Long term investment. Senator McCain wouldn’t support the package because of the lack of a long term investment in beefing up the U.S. Military now worn down because of two wars. Other Reps and Senators wouldn’t support the package even when they got such sweeteners as long term investments in tax cuts. If you want to discuss a plan to put money in your personal pocket immediately, then I refer you to a quite lovely letter that the S-R published just this morning, where the author commented on just that. But, on what would you spend it? Would you contribute your portion to rebuilding a bridge?—long term investment. Improving schools and in particular their state of the art science labs?—long term investment. Road improvements?—Also a long term investment. Putting up your own solar panels and windmill to provide power to your house?—Very much a long term investment. Retrofitting your auto to run completely on batteries or solar power?—Also a long term investment. Looks to me that Obama and Congress are directing your investments in those areas already. And that’s what you don’t grasp.
Bent on February 14 at 10:43 a.m.
“I think Dave allowing trolls to take over the site demeans it and will render it to the oblivion such a site deserves… ” — Sis

Sis, this is the very thing the righties and even the moderates (like myself) were screaming last year about this time when DFO started trolling southern Idaho for lefty bloggers to liberalize the conversation here.

He attracted a couple of pretty good posters (you being one of those), but he also had to engage in some troll management — i.e. booting BinkyBoy (thank God) — just to hang on to some of his regulars.

I agree that it kind of sucks when DFO starts swinging the pendulum by hand — especially when it swings away from you. But rest assured, he will swing it back… Once he gets the right mix of local commenters back to the blog.

Let’s not forget that it’s a municipal election year, and look who’s running:

Mayor Bloem, Mike Kennedy, Woody McEvers and Deanna Goodlander

November fireworks are going to smoke the 4th of July this year…
Bob on February 14 at 10:44 a.m.
Wow, hmoff and Keith are double teaming Joan, calling her elitist and insulting her intelligence with demeaning questions like “what part of stimulus don’t you understand”

You two (2) are damn lucky DFO’s hamstrung me or I’d step up for Joan (I hate seeing women picked on by male bullies) and school the both of you on acting like gentlemen.

Here’s a raincheck. You’ll get to cash it in one day.
Bob on February 14 at 10:47 a.m.
Actually that woulda been an even TOUGHER sounding post if I’d finished it:

“Here’s a PAINcheck. You’ll get to cash it here one day.”

Damn it, give us a preview button. Danm it.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 10:51 a.m.
KeithinCDA, that was quite the funny you posted just now. I didn’t care to say it, but Hmoffsuite acted like the unions are some kind of socialist group. Never having been in one, I couldn’t begin to argue for or against. But having been in the Army, I am fully aware of the division of labor that was at the core of HMO’s beef. I rely on past experience, not “research” as to why I disputed the fellow.

The U.S. Army has quite the set up for division of labor. Mine was initially in the hotel series. So here’s a little matter for you to chew on. Say the combat dude finds his hummer breaks down. It is a carb problem that he can easily fix. But, he has to call on the mechanic or engineer with the specific knowledge/training to fix it for him. I have never been in the auto business, but from what HMO describes, sounds a lot like my experience in the military.
keithincda on February 14 at 10:56 a.m.
Bob,

Pull up your big boy panties and quit squealing. I ‘d be saying the same thing to Joan if she’d said that to anybody else, not just HMO.

And you liberals all have the tone in your posts that you’re knowledge and understanding of anything is far superior to conservatives, let alone a moderate like me. Yet we espouse our views and all of sudden we’re parroting talk radio? Give me break dude.
I never said she was elitist I just asked her step back and consider that her comment may sound that way.

But you’re the reason this blog thrives and you all know it. I’ve tipped more than a few beers with you and hope to again but lately your ranting is like nails on chalk board. So go ahead and step off the curb and attack the messengers like you always do, it’s just your way man, and I get it.
Kage_Mann on February 14 at 10:56 a.m.
The problem with politicians is: They are always looking to get re-elected, that’s their goal. This democratic ‘Porkulus Package’
is about political payback and to garner allegences for future elections.I think that the three republican senators who voted for the stimulus bill did so for political expendiency, because they happen to reside in blue states and they want to get re-elected.It didn’t hurt that Arlen Spector was invited to the White House for the Super Bowl party either.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 11:02 a.m.
Bob, I have dealt with male bullies so often that I have my own methods of reprimanding them. I keep a distance through blogs and message boards and just keep on challenging them. There are worse dudes out there than these guys. Do believe that. And again Keith, there is nothing elitist in relying on past experience. I am not so sure that Hmoffsuite much appreciates division of labor. He can describe it, but I am not so sure he understands what it’s about. I do. And that’s because I’ve been there.
Bob on February 14 at 11:07 a.m.
Oh gimme a break, Keith. You’ve been poking me for weeks and I’ve been ignoring it because I, unlike you, tend to be respectful and cool with peeps I’ve shared beers with. It’s part of my Viking Warrior genetic-construct, I guess. You share beers with a guy, you have his back. You don’t try to poke his genitals with a long unbent wire coat hanger covered in rainbow yarn and glitter tape. Know what I mean?

As to “moderate”, I always snort when right wingers call themselves moderates or *independents* when in fact by any measure of political alignment they are GOP Cons.

But Keith, I still like you even if you like to throw gravel at giants. ;-)
Cindy_H on February 14 at 11:10 a.m.
“It’s a newspaper’s duty to print the news and raise hell.”

Which DFO’s accomplished. With a little help from his friends and ..er..others :-)
Bob on February 14 at 11:18 a.m.
In the early days he didn’t have comments sections so he’d invite emails from readers, and VERY early on he would get riled up by my left leaning correspondence and occasionally front page them under something I think he called “peanut gallery” or something like that. Then he got comments sections and the rest is a sort of horrifying history ripe with treachery and doom.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 11:49 a.m.
Dave didn’t really peanut gallery me by name, Bob. If he mentioned something I said, he’d do so without providing credit where it was due. I guess he had to have gotten utterly tired of getting e-mailed all the time and got the help of blogmeister Ryan to set up something for him. Now that he does blog, the commentary does arrive hot and heavy.
hmoffsuite on February 14 at 11:53 a.m.
Arch >>> ” I am not so sure that Hmoffsuite much appreciates division of labor. He can describe it, but I am not so sure he understands what it’s about”

My major at WSU was economics. I can assure you that I understand what it is about. Another rather applicable discipline to understand is ‘productivity’.
DFO on February 14 at 12:40 p.m.
>I agree that it kind of sucks when DFO starts swinging the pendulum by hand — especially when it swings away from you. But rest assured, he will swing it back… Once he gets the right mix of local commenters back to the blog — Bent<

;-)
Me on February 14 at 2:50 p.m.
Haven’t been in here since last night - I see it hasn’t changed and is the same neener neener going on.

New development though I think - does Repbublican poster or conservative poster now equal TROLL?

I guess if you lean right, even if you are a regular you are nothing but a troll.

” I think Dave allowing trolls to take over the site demeans it and will render it to the oblivion such a site deserves.”

I hardly think Dave is allowing ‘trolls’ to take over the site. I guess you all just think you own it and rule - like the High School Jocks of our past….

Do you really all just want everyone else gone so you can swagger back and forth doing high-fives? Would that really be any fun just listening to yourselves?
Arpie on February 14 at 5:15 p.m.
Thanks for the great reply HMO. I disagree. I know there are a lot of out of work tradesmen around these parts that would be glad to spend the next year or so retrofitting existing homes and making them more energy efficient.

I view insulation the same way I view planting trees. I don’t know who said it, but the old saw works. “The best time to plant a tree was ten years ago. The second best time is now.” I see no down side in this. Whereas you and many other conservatives always seem to say, “Ya ya we’ll get to that later.”
keithincda on February 14 at 5:31 p.m.
dollars to donuts this weatherization thing is a “buy it 1st, get a tax break in return” incentive. I’ve yet to see the bill defining it but I’d be willing to bet that they ain’t just gonna give all of us checks to buy materials and hire people to do the work.
If this is the case a lot of people that need weatherization won’t get it cause they have to use their own to pay for it all and then take it off their taxes and then it will probably only be a per centage of the amount spent not 100%.
That will be slow to put people to work.

just my opinion, nothing to back it up yet and I hope I’m wrong.
keithincda on February 14 at 5:51 p.m.
this is off yahoo news…
“Homeowners who add energy-efficient windows, furnaces and air conditioners can get a tax credit to cover 30 percent of the costs, up to a total of $1,500.”

Seems as if you gotta spend $4500 on the right stuff to get a max of $1500 dollars back, and then only as a tax credit.

I see that as a problem for a lot of people that could really use the upgrades for older less efficient homes but don’t have the money lying around to do it.
Arch_Druid on February 14 at 8:05 p.m.
Just got to address that one Hmoffsuite with a major LOL! If productivity is what concerns you, well I am sure that unions are just as productive as anyone else. They only go on strike when they believe that pensions and other work related issues are getting a hit. I’ll remind you that I don’t happen to be a member of a union. But I’ll also remind you that the unions managed to get work place laws passed that you are generally a beneficiary of. And those work place laws factor into any area of the economy that you care to mention. You wouldn’t do without them, believe me.

So, if you are so anti-union on the basis of productivity, then you would also have to be anti everything they represent and everything they did on your behalf. To include pensions, health insurance, Social Security, vacation, etc. You take those for a given. And that “left wing union” got it for you.

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About this blog

D.F. Oliveria is a columnist and blogger for The Spokesman-Review. Huckleberries Online was judged the best 2008 Idaho newspaper blog by the Idaho Press Club. And the best 2007 news blog in the Pacific Northwest by the Society for Professional Journalist. Print Huckleberries is a past winner of the Herb Caen Memorial Column contest by the National Association of Newspaper Columnists. The Readership Institute of Northwestern University cited this blog as a good example of online community journalism.