Huckleberries Online

MikeK: Tubbs Hill Tours Deserve Shot

Posted by DFO

March 6, 2009 8:15 a.m. • 17 comments

Since this idea came forward, I have heard about a lot of commercial activity in the parks and public spaces that has gone on ‘underground’. For example: photographers taking senior portraits on Tubbs Hill; private for-pay tours scheduled on Tubbs Hill by the Resort (given by Robert Singletary, a local treasure); for-profit yoga and physical fitness classes being held in Phippeny Park; for-profit scuba instructors and classes who use City Beach for putting into the water, etc. All of these have great merit and I wouldn’t want to be a event-Gestapo on this sort of thing, but if people want us to be completely consistent, we have to look at it. I’ve also heard the old saying “consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.” Tough call/Councilman MikeK, Huckleberries Online. Full comment below.

Question: Do you understand Councilman MikeK’s reasoning, even though you may not agree with it?

I was sort of dreading this moment, but I gotta step up to the plate and take my medicine - I was one of 5 who voted for this pilot project. Here’s my general thinking:

All of these have great merit and I wouldn’t want to be a event-Gestapo on this sort of thing, but if people want us to be completely consistent, we have to look at it. I’ve also heard the old saying “consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.” Tough call.

I have heard from people who very much support this Tubbs Hill pilot project idea, and people who very much oppose it. I respect and value both impressions.

This is a one-year RFQ for a test project. The total length of time is basically July and August, between 8 and 10 weeks out of the year max. Staff is going to come up with the strict definitions of what is acceptable i.e. how many per day (likely no more than two tours), how many people per tour (likely 10-12, no more than 14), criteria a tour guide has to follow (should they pick up trash? should they have only designated spots where they can stop with the group and talk? should the kayak component go around Tubbs Hill or only to a certain point and then back?) and the like.

This could go down as a major mistake and a terrible vote for me when it’s all said and done - I don’t know. It could also be the beginning of a precedent on commercial activity that would ensure good, fair, common-sense uses. Currently the policy says No Commercial Use of any parks or public spaces anytime without express permission and permits, but how do we enforce that? Is that the right policy?

Here’s another issue that’s worked it’s way through and has been vexing and ties into this overall issue: if a commercial endeavor (housing development) across the lake wants to use the 3rd Street Dock to ferry guests back and forth, can they? If the boat they use is actually a jointly owned asset of the Homeowners Association and not a part of a commercial venture, does that make a difference? If realtors are showing lakefront real estate to people and they are using the 3rd street public dock to launch and land, can/should that practice be banned as a violation of the no commercial access policy?

I have had my eyes opened a bit about the policy, usage, emotions, and history of parks on this issue in a way I hadn’t experienced before. I don’t know what my final answer will be, because just when I feel like I’ve decided and can make a confident, definitive statement of position and principle on something, someone will respond legitimately “well, the for-profit day care kids are touring Tubbs Hill too and have been for years, and that’s technically a violation of the policy as well - should we shut them down?”

And then I sigh and say, yea, this is all a pretty grey area, and while it’s vexing, if we can get good people together with their hearts in the right place and the right level of respect for the community’s assets, we’ll figure it out.

Not sure what or how, but I do believe that.

Sorry to those that are disappointed in this vote. It wasn’t an easy one, and I’m keenly aware of the emotion on this. I’ll keep watching closely and won’t take anything for granted. Please keep in touch with me at: mkennedy@cdaid.org or my cell phone 661-7337.

17 comments on this post so far. Add yours!

hmoffsuite on March 06 at 8:38 a.m.
I think MikeK is taking exactly the right approach on this matter. It needs to be thought out, intelligently and not emotionally, and that is precisely what he is doing. This is an example of how I like to see my Government officials act. He is being entirely responsible, imo. And, fwiw, I like the way he has laid out his thinking.
Sam on March 06 at 8:57 a.m.
So Mike you want to add fees on to a high school senior’s already-high portraits bill so the photog can snap their photos on there?

Has some type of harm been caused by these people that spurred this?

Consistent about what?
MikeK on March 06 at 9:09 a.m.
Sam - good questions. No I don’t want to add fees. What got this discussion started was a formal request from a company to give guided tours of Tubbs Hill. In that process it was learned that commercial activity of that and other sorts was happening on Tubbs already (and a lot of other places, as described). And since the current policy and ordinance in the city is No Commercial Use without permitting, there’s sort of an inherent conflict between the policy and what’s happening in reality.

As far as anyone knows there haven’t been any problems or harm caused at the moment - which is great and no one wants to change. But there have been a few growing issues regarding use of publicly owned assets, also as I described above, that are prompting a review of a few things: 1) to ensure that people are being treated fairly; 2) use of public assets like waterfront docks and land is being open to all and regulated where necessary; and 3) commercial use is known and looked at to ensure that we have common sense regulations.

I’ve found in this job that sometimes a small pebble can cause a larger rock slide and it’s better to understand the scope of something instead of looking at one item alone in a vacuum. I think the folks who came to the city about the tours (ROW) have actually gone well and above what others have done, in that they sought permission and a process instead of just diving in and hoping they didn’t have to someday ask forgiveness.

As I said, this isn’t as clear cut as I might have expected when someone told me: “people want to do paid tours on Tubbs Hill”. My first thought then was: “no way, I oppose that.” But when you listen to all parties and contemplate the issue with a lot of input, it becomes more of nuanced. We’ll see where it goes.
Kage_Mann on March 06 at 9:10 a.m.
The commercialization of Tubbs Hill won’t work, because it will establish a precedent that won’t be acceptable IMO.If the city allows paid guided tours, then you might have disabled people who might want to go, like wheel chair bound people.Then you’d have to build ramps for them because, you can’t discriminate against them and if one of them ever got hurt, then the city could be liable, because the city of CDA owns the park.Hence, the taxpayers would have to cover it in the end.Just because,the tour co.has insurance to supposedly cover a mishap, might not exempt the city from a potential liability.

The bottom line is:Because of potential liability to the city, it won’t work.IMO
Rosalind on March 06 at 10:01 a.m.
As the clip from the new “Parks and Recreation” show said….nobody wanted the job. You have to deal with the public. I hate the public. The public is stupid.

Making decisions for a community regarding parks and rec is not easy, and there’s rarely a clear solution.
poolman on March 06 at 12:30 p.m.
If I owed a “tour company” or a “resort hotel” on the lake and could find suckers to pay me to give tours around Tubbs hill, that would purely be an entrepreneurial activity and quite frankly, no business of the city. I’d be happy to pay any relevant taxes and/or permit fees that might be required by the city, state, or Fed. What is the difference in this and say a fishing charter, or as MikeK has referenced, a professional photographer taking senior portraits in a public area. Since when did a yoga class in a park become labeled as a rogue “underground” “for-profit” activity? As a kid I briefly opened a lemonade stand on a sidewalk in front of my parent’s house – how was I so lucky to escape the long arm of the city council. Holy crap this story stinks of small town city finger pointing / hand in the cookie jar politics.

I think the real axe grind here is that the CDA resort is potentially charging willing clients /tourists for tours of the city, part of which includes the hill. Big deal - they also charge for airplane rides around the lake, boat rides (Michinock), and paragliding in front of the beach -it’s called tourism. I’m no fan of Hagadone Hospitality – but this is a little on the silly side.
Sam on March 06 at 1:51 p.m.
Maybe if I ever get laid off I’ll give guided tours on Tubbs Hill.

“And this is where I lost my swim trunks when I was 13.”

“Over here is where I saw those guys firing Roman candles at each other on the Fourth of July that one time and they started a small brush fire.”

“Did you know that Bing Crosby wanted to put a hotel on this thing? Hilarious, right? Yeah, but he drank a lot.”

“Watch out for that dog poo.”

Tour over.

That’ll be $25 please.
Rosalind on March 06 at 2:16 p.m.
Tours around Tubbs Hill. Funny.
Stickman on March 06 at 8:03 p.m.
Thanks Sam, priceless.

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D.F. Oliveria is a columnist and blogger for The Spokesman-Review. Huckleberries Online was judged the best 2008 Idaho newspaper blog by the Idaho Press Club. And the best 2007 news blog in the Pacific Northwest by the Society for Professional Journalist. Print Huckleberries is a past winner of the Herb Caen Memorial Column contest by the National Association of Newspaper Columnists. The Readership Institute of Northwestern University cited this blog as a good example of online community journalism.