Spokane7
34°Quick links: NCAA tournament • Gonzaga hoops • Easter photo contest • Washington Legislature • Idaho Legislature
My store is teetering on the edge of needing to hire one more person to help out with “back-
end” store operations during the hopefully busy holiday selling season. The tasks prescribed would include cleaning the store and stocking shelves while also learning about our business and hopefully becoming a part of our sales staff after the holiday season is over. My ideal candidate for this position would be a high school student looking for an after-school job. … I like to believe that I still embrace the old values of hard work and responsibility that my grandfather taught me and would love to teach those skills to younger workers and help them start their working lives with a solid employment reference. However, I find it hard to justify $8.55 an hour for someone on their first job, especially considering that I’m only able to pay my most senior sales associate just more than 50 cents per hour over minimum wage/Henry Johnston, Moscow-Pullman Daily News. More here.
Question: Washington’s minimum wage is higher than the national average. Does Henry Johnston make a good point that the Washington wage should be cut to help small business?
D.F. Oliveria is a columnist and blogger for The Spokesman-Review. Huckleberries Online was judged the best 2008 Idaho newspaper blog by the Idaho Press Club. And the best 2007 news blog in the Pacific Northwest by the Society for Professional Journalist. Print Huckleberries is a past winner of the Herb Caen Memorial Column contest by the National Association of Newspaper Columnists. The Readership Institute of Northwestern University cited this blog as a good example of online community journalism.
999 W. Riverside, Spokane, WA 99201
P.O. Box 2160, Spokane, WA 99210
Main switchboard: (509) 459-5000 • (800) 338-8801
Newsroom: (509) 459-5400 • (800) 789-0029
Customer service: (800) 338-8801
© Copyright 2010, The Spokesman-Review
Phaedrus on November 24 at 9:50 a.m.
Maybe he could get someone to work for tips only.
Flag as inappropriate
hmoffsuite on November 24 at 9:58 a.m.
Does Henry Johnston make a good point that the Washington wage should be cut to help small business?
Cutting the minimum wage would not only help small business, but those looking for work as well. Entry level positions lead to full time positions and higher positions leading to increased earnings. Those entering the work force need an opportunity to learn how to work. Good workers will rise to a higher level of compensation. A minimum wage is a starting point, not an ending point.
Flag as inappropriate
Sisyphus on November 24 at 9:59 a.m.
Well I reckon he's named digger for that shovel he carries. Someone should take it from him.
Flag as inappropriate
keithincda on November 24 at 10:00 a.m.
Digger, I hope you have chain mail underwear on today cause your azz is gonna get chewed on this one.
But not by me. I agree.
I understand that it is a very economically difficult time right now for people and for businesses but I can't help and think back to when I owned my business in Spokane (I have not since 2003). I had 21 employees and that was about 2 people shy of the amount I needed for proper scheduling and running of a 24 hour a day retail operation that operated on extremely small margins and in a very competitive market place.
I think at the time min wage in WA was $6.75 or something like that. No way that business could have supported wages at $8+ per hour nowadays. I put 21 people out of work (not counting myself) when I finally closed the business. Still bothers me to this day that those people were affected, many of them worked for me for 7 or 8 years. Good luck on this one.
Flag as inappropriate
sue on November 24 at 10:03 a.m.
Hm, I'm curious now, Henry. This is from a previous thread about your tardy employees: “We compensate our employees well (everyone on payroll makes at least $1 above WA minimum wage, + generous bonuses and commissions) which is why I expect a certain standard of responsiblity.” So which is it? Are you workers well paid, at least $1.00 over minimum wage plus commissions and bonuses? or is it $.50 over min wage? It's kind of hard to have a conversation about wages when your story keeps changing. Henry is the reason that we need fair labor laws. If he could pay $1.00/hr, he would.
Flag as inappropriate
Cabbage Boy on November 24 at 10:08 a.m.
@sis. funny guy. Good zinger.
@Keith, unpopular as it is, I am gonna agree with his premise. Not his arguments or approach, but at least the premise.
Flag as inappropriate
Amy Y on November 24 at 10:15 a.m.
You could always work with your local Dept. of Labor and create the position with subsidized funding. Lots of out of work adults out there and the department is anxious to get them to work. Many places offer subsidies to employers whereby the employer either pays a little towards the wage or sometimes nothing at all. You get an employee for less, an unemployed person gets job experience and a wage. I'm not up to speed on Washington programs but it's worth looking into.
Flag as inappropriate
poolman on November 24 at 10:43 a.m.
My main problem with Diggers argument is the fact that he is working for a national chain. That dollar or two per hour isn’t coming out of his pocket – although he painstakingly acts as if it is in order to make an argument about the minimum wage in WA State.
IMO a manager in Diggers situation you should be focused on 1) the image and integrity of the store, so far he has done a nice job of making it sound cheap and run by an obsessive compulsive manager. 2) Customer service – if the customers are not being satisfied due to lack of man-power – the corporation needs to make a decision about staffing based on financials and a local forecast. 3) Career development of the staff. If a staff member is underpaid for their skill set – they should be encouraged to pursue other opportunities that will be more financially rewarding.
Flag as inappropriate
Phaedrus on November 24 at 10:58 a.m.
I like to believe that I still embrace the old values of hard work and responsibility that my grandfather taught me…
If that is true then Henry needs to roll up his sleeves and do that extra work that he can't afford to pay for because that's what good mangers do.
Flag as inappropriate
spokelooneh on November 24 at 11:54 a.m.
This is really quite comical. Sis nailed it, and I'm glad sue remembered as I did that Hank had previously said he paid his employees at least a dollar and hour more than minimum wage.
So which is it, Hank? Were you lying then, or are you lying now?
Let's see, Hank is suggesting that he pay some kid for an after-school, part time job, $7.50 an hour instead of $8.55, a $1.05 an hour savings.
So, let's say the kid works 20 hours a week, thus saving Hank a little over $20 a week, or a grand total of around $100 over the holiday shopping season.
You can't make that up on margin, Hank? It's not worth it to you to put out an extra hundred bucks so the backroom can be clean and the shelves stocked?
You are the consummate miser. The embodiment of Ebenezer Scrooge.
Oh, and that claim that you're gonna have the kid continue to work for you after the holidays, when your business probably drops by 30-40%? Yeah, sure you are.
I'm so old I remember when Radio Shack employees had actual career positions, and actually knew quite a bit about electronics, and were paid a living wage, but that's got to be at least 15 years ago.
Flag as inappropriate
Herb Huseland on November 24 at 12:34 p.m.
It's a tough issue. First, Henry's point is a legitimate one. The down side, though, as some state do, if the minimum is lowered for first time hires, or even all high school age workers, It would mean that none of these businesses wold hire adults, due to the imbalance. I think that Washington State perhaps got too generous, perhaps due to the west side economy and didn't take into consideration the disparity of prevailing wages on the east side of the state.
Flag as inappropriate
Digger on November 24 at 12:36 p.m.
#1 - Poolman - we are a FRANCHISE store. I get ZERO support from our corporate office with regards to paying my employees. We pay for the right to use the logo and buy products from them. Thats where their involvement stops with the way my store is run. And since I'm on a profit share based salary, yes, that extra $$ does come out of my pocket.
#2 - RE: Employee wages. We recently went through a perfectally legal wage realignment in our store to keep our business afloat. That required pay-cuts and hour cuts across the board - including myself. It was everyone take a cut or one person loses a job and we all work more days and more hours. I gave up $4,000 annually off my base salary (which wasn't high to begin with) and all my employees took cuts from where they were before.
Thankfully we have enough of a team attitude here that my guys gave up some of their extra hourly to save a position.
Despite what you may think about the kind of manager I am, I'm not a scrooge and I'm not cheap. I respect my guys and we have a very good working relationship as well as friendships outside of work.
So unless you've actually worked with me, in my store, please don't sit back and tell me what a bad guy I am.
#3 - RE: Making it up on Margins - I challenge anyone to run a small electronics store like mine and carry any more than a 40% margin on everyday products. I hear at least once a day “Thats too expensive, I'm going to go buy it online”. Oftentimes my store is only a few dollars more than the online price - and factor shipping we're actually cheaper.
Oh well. I've determined that no matter what I say on this forum nobody is going to agree with me simply because I am who I am.
Have fun tearing me apart - I'm not going to sit and watch.
Flag as inappropriate
Phaedrus on November 24 at 12:42 p.m.
I respect my guys and we have a very good working relationship as well as friendships outside of work. —Digger
If what you say here is true, perhaps you should just quit writing about your place of business because you sure don't convey that message in your writing.
Flag as inappropriate
DFO on November 24 at 12:57 p.m.
I need to toss in a caution here. Some of you enjoy taking personal swipes at Digger re: his business stands. Digger has been a long-time — and continues to be a respected — part of the HBO blogosphere. It's one thing to take light jabs. But another to skewer him with shots that are off subject. If you disagree with his stance on the minimum wage, concentrate your disagreement on that subject.
Flag as inappropriate
OrangeTV on November 24 at 1:05 p.m.
DFO, you beat me to it. I don't agree with Digger so much on this one, but why is necessary to issue personal attacks? Lame. Certain posters around here lately (of all political slants) are starting to remind me why I decided to quit looking at the Cd'A Press comments. The negativity and juvenile personal attacks left me feeling drained. I really don't want to come away with that same feeling when I check in here.
Flag as inappropriate
idawa on November 24 at 1:09 p.m.
I have mixed sentiments regarding the minimum wage, but I do think that the WA minimum wage application is onerous where there is a large pay differential within the state. While $8+ is not a sufficient rate on the West-side of the Cascades, it is probably sufficient for the economic conditions of Pullman and most of the rest of the state.
He has a point with his concerns. But it is tough not to discount his view given his track record with previous notions of business management that he espouses in his articles and posts.
Flag as inappropriate
Herb Huseland on November 24 at 1:10 p.m.
Amen!
Flag as inappropriate
Herb Huseland on November 24 at 1:11 p.m.
I kinda thought we had cleared up the issue of calling someone a liar, just yesterday.
Flag as inappropriate
Phaedrus on November 24 at 1:35 p.m.
…given his track record with previous notions of business management that he espouses in his articles and posts.
Exactly. Henry, as sue correctly notes, made comments previously that are in conflict with his current comments; in his prior piece on employee punctuality he also made conflicting statements regarding his demands on employee's time. Since Henry is a columnist (as well as a retail store manager) one would hope that his writing would shoe greater discipline in regards to the facts. And when a writer has to consistently claim “you missed my point,” (a la Mary Souza) or some such “you're not understanding” defense of their words, then I believe that writer should probably spend more time critically rereading their column to ensure that it makes the point they are trying to make. The time to do that is prior to publishing it.
Flag as inappropriate
nic on November 24 at 1:40 p.m.
@ OTV
Thanx for bringing the Cd'A Press comments section into the conversation - a place that has been blessed with the fragrance of a high school locker room and the friendliness of a tomb.
Can we add references to the Press comments to Godwin's Law? … that the longer (or more active) a thread on HBO, the more likely it will draw comparisons to the CDA Press threads.
Flag as inappropriate
Cabbage Boy on November 24 at 1:46 p.m.
“that the longer (or more active) a thread on HBO, the more likely it will draw comparisons to the CDA Press threads.”
You might just get a visit to the cooler for that prediction. :)
Flag as inappropriate
OrangeTV on November 24 at 1:54 p.m.
Sure nic, as soon as DFO stops linking to stories on that website and pointing his readers in that direction.
Flag as inappropriate
DFO on November 24 at 2:01 p.m.
@ Nic/Cabbage/OTV; occasionally, the Press online comments section provides valuable fodder for HBO. Ditto for Marybill's site. A good example is the sergeant major's response to Spencer in this morning's comments. Spencer had made his claims on both main media Web sites in this community. And the sergeant major's response from Iraq was valuable to dispel yet another conspiracy theory being circulated by the usual suspects. Unlike the Press/OpenCDA.com sites that childishly refer to HBO as the Spokane gossip site, I give credit to the Press site for the information it provides (much of it good) and for allowing the conspiracy theorists gathering places, so the good people of this community can keep an eye on them.
Flag as inappropriate
spokelooneh on November 24 at 2:41 p.m.
“Thats too expensive, I'm going to go buy it online”. Oftentimes my store is only a few dollars more than the online price - and factor shipping we're actually cheaper.”
-Hank
Then why don't you offer a buck or two discount, point out the shipping costs, the satisfaction in getting the product immediately, and GET THE SALE while making the customer happy and more likely to repeat business with your store? That's Retail Electronics Salesmenship 101. You don't seem to have a basic understanding about how competition works.
And no, that doesn't mean you price-match every single time.
Do you know anything about overturning customers' objections?
You're unwilling to spend a measly $100 bucks over the holiday season to assure that at this very busy time of year that your inventory is kept stocked and your backroom clean and organized? Ridiculous.
Penny-wise and pound-foolish.
“Oh well. I've determined that no matter what I say on this forum nobody is going to agree with me simply because I am who I am.
Have fun tearing me apart - I'm not going to sit and watch.”
-Hank
Completely predictable, another “Checkers speech.”
Flag as inappropriate
Cindy H on November 24 at 3:07 p.m.
((Digger))
Just saying.
Flag as inappropriate
marmitetoasty on November 24 at 3:53 p.m.
If you pay peanuts you mainly employ monkeys……. just saying :)
x
Flag as inappropriate
Joker on November 24 at 4:07 p.m.
I believe Digger is trying to do the right thing. Consider this: Digger's pay cut along with everybody elses seems noble, but in the end it dooms everybody.
A lot of businesses use this wage strategy to save jobs. It sucks. The employees never get their wages back once the economy bounces back. No. 2. the people are typically asked to work harder than ever before for less pay, which lowers morale. No. 3. The employee is forced to take a second job to make up the difference and is less productive.
I'd rather have fewer employees and be able to pay them a living wage. Digger's employees makes about S19,000 a year, maybe a little more with commissions (if they exist).
Even at $24,000, most people can't live on that wage. They
need a second or third job if they're single. If they're married with kids, the spouse needs to work at least one job.
Digger should think about eliminating two positions, not filling the back end position he wanted to fill and shift those dollars to the quality employees he does have. His employees will appreciate their value, work harder, and have more money in their pockets to spend, which ultimately helps the economy.
Just a thought…
Flag as inappropriate
hmoffsuite on November 24 at 4:15 p.m.
Joker. I agree with you completely.
Flag as inappropriate
hmoffsuite on November 24 at 4:22 p.m.
As a matter of fact, I might take it a step further and offer the employees an opportunity to own a small portion of the business. That could be done in lieu of bonuses, raises or even to offset any salary concessions that have to be made. It's amazing what 'ownership' does for the 'team'.
Flag as inappropriate