Huckleberries Online

P.S. Pastor Plans To Burn Quran

Posted by DFO

Sept. 7, 2010 5:44 p.m. • 35 comments

Rev. Terry Jones poses for a photo at the Dove World Outreach Center in Gainesville, Fla., recently. Jones vowed to go ahead with plans to burn copies of the Quran to protest the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks despite warnings from the White House and the top U.S. general in Afghanistan that doing so would endanger American troops overseas. (AP Photo/John Raoux)

Question: Are the fears of President Obama and a top general in Afghanistan real — that a protest that involves burning the Quran will endanger American fighting men & women?

35 comments on this post so far. Add yours!

bcnqrgd on September 07 at 6:02 p.m.
Yes
Sisyphus on September 07 at 6:16 p.m.
Its obscene. Burning a book considered just as holy and devotional as Christians consider the Bible or Jews consider the Talmud. Its abhorrent to be that disrespectful. Its incredible folly to violently display such disrespect to over a billion people who consider Islam to be their faith. It falls directly into the fundamentalist play book. On both sides. They seem to have developed a symbiotic relationship of hatred and are hell bent on dragging civilization down with them.
irishman on September 07 at 6:22 p.m.
Book burning is appalling. I have other thoughts on the right rev but i’ll leave them be.
Soaf on September 07 at 6:23 p.m.
Look up the word “Ignorance” and you’ll see a picture of Rev. Terry Jones in the definition.
MatthewRoot on September 07 at 6:46 p.m.
I trust General Petraeus. If he says it will endanger U.S. troops, then it will.

The Wrong-Rev. Terry Jones’ “church” is in financial difficulty. This is probably a publicity stunt to garner contributions from like-minded ignoramuses.
toadman on September 07 at 7:07 p.m.
What a shining example of Christ like love and forgiveness that are the pillars of the Christian faith. His followers must be so proud.

His brand of Christianity may well be the first example many Muslims experience on Al-Jazeera. Perhaps some Muslim overseas, or over here, will say “I learned everything I needed to know about Christianity on September 11th, 2010.”

;-)

See how that works now?
hmoffsuite on September 07 at 7:15 p.m.
I wonder how much outrage there might be if it were the Bible being burned. Not much, these days, I am afraid. Where are the arguments for the constiutionality of burning the Quran? Are the Muslim terrorists putting forth a shining example of the beliefs of the Quran, toad? Their followers should be so proud.
SmittyK on September 07 at 7:29 p.m.
hmoffsuite:
I know that Christians like to pretend their their rights are constantly being infringed by inserting themselves into the debate when it is not necessary nor relevant to the discussion at hand

HOWEVER

I think there would be a lot of outrage, the fact is that this idiot pastor is making all Christians look bad with the intolerance and hatred that is associated with the crazy nut jobs who pretend to represent Jesus Christ and his teachings.

No Book should ever be burned no Book should ever be banned, no matter what your belief system is, it is inappropriate to force your beliefs down someone’s throat who disagrees
MatthewRoot on September 07 at 7:34 p.m.
I beg to differ, hmoffsuite.
If anyone were to hold a Bible burning event, it would create huge protests.
sue on September 07 at 7:38 p.m.
From Mother Teresa:
“Spread love everywhere you go; first of all in your house. Give love to your children, to your wife or husband, to a next door neighbor. Let no one ever come to you without leaving better and happier. Be the living expression of God’s kindness; kindness in your face, kindness in your eyes, kindness in your smile.”
Kind of the definition of Christianity to me. When people would bring her someone who was dying, she would bury that person according to his or her belief. If she didn’t know, she would bury them according to Hindu rituals, since they were the majority. She truly is a saint.
We should not give this man and his “church” any attention whatsoever. While he has the right to do what he wants, it is America after all, we don’t have to notice it.
JIMMYMAC on September 07 at 7:45 p.m.
I agree this is a stupid move and looks poorly on Christians. I also believe there is a bit of truth to what HMO says whether people admit it or not. In my humble opinion I don’t think that Jesus would be burning the Quran, but He would probably remind us that He is more than what is portrayed between it’s covers.
Mr_Bloggy on September 07 at 8:10 p.m.
I think the only book(s) that should be burned are the romance crapolas slung by Nicholas Sparks. Certainly, he is not the worst of the offenders in that vile genre, but he was the best name for an author of books to be burned.

While there can be no question in the mind of a true Godly believer that Jesus would strap on a M2022A1 FLASH (Flame Assault Shoulder Weapon) handed to him by a genuflected and praying Godly young Marine, and Jesus would FLAME the hell out of any infidel or heathen or pagan or Democratic Party precinct chairperson, who dared mess with the Book of His Dad’s aka The Holy Bible.

Burn a bible go straight to hell. Do not pass Go. Do not collect $200 from some bleeding heart liberal who wants to give all the hard earned profits and tax loopholed loot of Capitalists to poor and disabled people who are perfectly capable of working in minimum wage service jobs. No get out of hell card, either.

True Believers don’t need whiny pastors in Bumpkinville, North Bumpkinolina, or wherever, making a big dumb redneck gospel gropin’ southern fuss and grotty groaning grab for attention by burning up them Korans. True Believers and the Righteously Saved just need to turn the other cheek when slapped by an angry Radical Islamist, and duck real quick-like when Jesus pops off four 66mm incendiary rockets right into his big flowing old beard.

Remember what Jesus said at the Last Supper?

Hey, Judas, you gonna eat all them flambeed bananas?
sue on September 07 at 8:21 p.m.
Well, Mr. Bloggy made me laugh out loud. I don’t think I’ve read a Nicholas Sparks book, although I’ve been tempted. HMO, and Jimmymac, you’re both wrong. No one should burn the Bible or the Quran, or any other book. If we’re about anything, as Americans, it’s freedom of thought, and opinion, and information. Let’s not forget equality. Really, it’s an American value, too, that often gets overlooked.
Cindy_H on September 07 at 8:25 p.m.
Don’t do it Sue! I was in a book club and I had to read TWO Nicholas Sparks’ books in one year.
My IQ went down by a gazillion points, my eyes bled and I still had to sip cheap wine and smile.
I’ve sworn off of book clubs.
Besides, everyone knows newspapers make better kindling.
brentandrews on September 07 at 8:32 p.m.
The fellow burning the Koran is not hurting anyone, and the media projecting this story around the world so a few criminally insane Muslims can see it is not hurting anyone, either. But if you attack one, why not the other? Instead of running down this one fellow why shouldn’t the government be turning up the pressure on media organizations not to tell the story? Governments that tell private citizens when and when not to speak their minds, are what we were supposed to be fighting against. If the media wasn’t covering this fellow, no one would know about him. Certainly none of us. Now the general and everyone else is piling on. We have become slaves to the terrorists. It started with the Patriot Act. Now we’ve turned on each other. This general who can’t even win a war is turning on Americans back home as an excuse. We’re powerless against these radical Islamic terrorists, and we’ll never admit it. So like an alcoholic going to drink, we go to war - around the world against brown people in rags, and here at home, against speech. The real danger to the troops is the politicians and generals who wage wars. I say let the man speak, whether it’s the fellow burning the book or the fellow writing the story about the fellow burning the book. It’s a free country, or it isn’t.
HonestGeorge on September 07 at 8:53 p.m.
Question: Are the fears of President Obama and a top general in Afghanistan real — that a protest that involves burning the Quran will endanger American fighting men & women?

They’re probably correct but the impression of Petraus and Obama wringing their hands in fear of possible repercussions doesn’t set well with me. Anytime that we place an American soldier in a Muslim country there is a good dose of local hatred spread on them and our troops leave the USA expecting it. Al Jazeera will always find something in America to link with their issue of the day.
sue on September 07 at 8:59 p.m.
I’m always surprised at how much my 3 sons agree on most issues. It took me a long time to understand what they were saying about the “real news.” I grew up learning about journalistic principles, but they were telling a different story. General Petraeus is telling the truth. The US has not always been the good guy, like we want to believe. The US has had a bad record that does not always see the light of day, in print or not. Some of our policies have caused the anger that has spawned the terrorists.Our free press, and freedom of information should expose this. We should denounce it. We should vote it out. My fear is that we will do the opposite. We will listen to the glenns and the sarahs and the small-thinking talking heads that make us believe we’re the best. Americans are pretty darn good, but we’re not always the best. We should be.
toadman on September 07 at 9:28 p.m.
@hmoffsuite - you really just don’t get it, do you? Americans should be just as up in arms about Koran burning as Bible burning or any other expression of intolerance and hate.

What I was trying to convey in my comment, that I think everyone else seemed to understand, was that religious extremists, no matter their religion, misrepresent the entire faith from which they spring. Meaning, saying all Muslims are intolerant and willing to fly airplanes into buildings is exactly like saying all Christians burn Korans and blow up abortion clinics and murder family planning doctors. To me, it’s exactly the same.

Overgeneralizing is always wrong. Assigning the beliefs of a few, to an entire group shows ignorance.
JIMMYMAC on September 07 at 9:42 p.m.
Sue, where exactly am I wrong? Because there might be some truth, unfortunately, to what HMO said regarding those that would defend the burning of The Bible? I wasn’t suggesting that burning either is a good thing, actually confirming the idiocy of the act.
JBlim on September 07 at 10:15 p.m.
What do you expect with Fox “News” and right-wing hate radio stoking the flames of hatred? Yet another victory for ignorance.
Cis on September 07 at 11:26 p.m.
Smith-Kennedy, you said it best….

This reminds me of the pictures in my history book from
high school… of the German’s burning books…

Sad…very sad… too bad the media gave them any play at all..but that sells papers and etc.
kamm on September 07 at 11:42 p.m.
‘How you treat others is how you treat Jesus’
Mother Teresa
nic on September 08 at 7:02 a.m.
hmo, you correct - this apostate does have the constitutional right to burn the Qur’an (or the collected works of Nicholas Sparks) or what ever books he wants.

As an American I want to say “whatever makes you happy,” but as a Christian, I’m appalled. His actions are purely born of revenge (he told one reporter that “they” see no problems in burning Bibles or flags). As a supposed Christian, he should see so many things wrong with that statement and his impending actions. If he believes the words of the Bible, he should know that vengeance belongs to God. He should know that the Christian role is to reconcile - not condemn. He should be slow to anger - not publicizing his personal wrath.

Piranha 3D (horrible movie, don’t waste you money) demonstrated more Christ-like love than this so-called pastor and his proposed burning.

As a Christian, I no longer see this as an issue of constitutional rights. I see this as a misrepresentation of the gospel and an opposition to what a pastor’s ministry should represent.
nic on September 08 at 7:13 a.m.
If he wanted to burn anything that defiles protestantism, why doesn’t he throw in other holy books.

Heck, he could add in the Kabbalah, The Apocrypha, the vedas, the Buddhist Pitakas, The Book of Mormon, The Watchtower literature, and the complete works of L. Ron Hubbard.

Why doesn’t he do that? Because his actions are not about protecting the Christian faith. His actions are nothing more than one man’s attempt to piss off one singular group of people.
Bubblehead on September 08 at 7:35 a.m.
Sorry I was late getting in on this one — we were celebrating our 25th anniversary last night.

President Obama and Gen. Petraeus are right — this is the kind of thing that could tip some Muslim youth over the line into actively opposing Americans. This idiot has the Constitutional right to do what he’s doing, just as all right-thinking people have the Constitutional right (and, I believe, duty) to oppose him. Likewise, some lawyer who wants to make a name for himself has the right to gather a class of people who are stressed (for fear for their Servicepeople children, for instance) and sue the rectal hat wearer. They probably wouldn’t win, but it could definitely annoy the jerk — Constitutionally, of course.

IMHO, all book burning is wrong, no matter who’s doing it; allowed by the Constitution, but morally wrong.
Charles_Dixon on September 08 at 7:39 a.m.
In 2005 Newsweek ran a story about Guantanamo interrogators who allegedly flushed a Koran down the toilet in an attempt to rattle a detainee. Sixteen people were killed in Afghanistan as a result of protests that happened in response to the Newsweek story. Newsweek later retracted the story because it couldn’t substantiate that the flushing actually occurred.

Seems to me the media is all too willing to cover this kind of stuff regardless of who gets hurt or killed. If it makes America look bad, then they’re all over the story like stink on dog poop.

And it’s also interesting that when it comes to things that are offensive to Islam, the question becomes whether something should or shouldn’t be done, not whether it’s legal. But when it comes to something done in the name of Islam that might be offensive to someone else, the only question asked is whether it’s legal. For example, many people have been quick to point out that building the Islamic Center near the World Trade Center site would be perfectly legal. No laws prohibit that construction. Yet the issue isn’t whether it’s legal to build it; the issue is whether it’s appropriate. Whether it’s offensive to other Americans should be considered in the context of what happened on 9/11. It’s not just a legal issue.

This moron preacher in Florida has every legal right to burn the Koran and whatever other print he wants to. But this issue is framed not as a legal issue, but a wrong versus right issue. And I think it is important to look at it this way. What we tolerate and accept as a society does go above and beyond what is codified in the law. I personally think this church’s Koran burn event is very wrong for a number of reasons, one of which is that religiously significant items like a Koran or a Bible should be respected in society even if you don’t belong to that religion.

But let’s place everyone under the same standard, not just some.
Sisyphus on September 08 at 8:03 a.m.
Reems of rampant ignorance burning the pages, with hmoff holding the lighter.

“I wonder how much outrage there might be if it were the Bible being burned. Not much, these days, I am afraid.”—moves straight for the false equivalency to try and make the pastor’s actions seem somehow warranted. In fact the cowardly pastor is deep in ‘merica, surrounded by its military might as well as a group his own Christian militants. Its a chicken sh!t move and he knows both the context and and the volatility of his actions, made ever more painfully aware by General Patreaus and the administration. There would be rampant disgust over the burning of the Bible, as if that meant a damn thing in your specious contention. But I’m sure you are going to get your wish should this come about. Indeed my whole comment above was to cause some empathy in people sympathetic to the Pastor. I guarantee that Islam has far more fundies than we do who will be more than happy to burn some Bibles cause of this jackass.

As SK pointed out this isn’t about Christianity v. Islam, its about the tolerance of liberal democracy and the intolerance of religious fundamentalism. Islamic fundamentalists have been recruiting by specifically claiming that America is the great Satan and far too permissive. Burning their holy book on national TV just confirms the truth of their argument and hands them a tremendous propaganda tool. Why not give them a truck full of RPGs? I’m pretty sure Christ would have us turn the other cheek.

“Where are the arguments for the constiutionality of burning the Quran?”—um, to what end? No one is saying anything about “the right” to do it. It seems only the right wing confuses the “right” to do something, with the propriety of doing so.

“Are the Muslim terrorists putting forth a shining example of the beliefs of the Quran, toad?”—no they’re telling their potential recruits that America’s permissive ways are corruptive and against God. And gosh if people like this pastor aren’t making it easy for them.

“Their followers should be so proud.”—and all the pastor and his apologists are doing is creating more of them.

In hmoff’s world one Muslim is just like any other and therefore all are guilty for the crimes of a few. That’s a fundamentalist viewpoint if ever there was one. And the fundamentalists will destroy us.

Anyone who wants to see the great forces at work fomenting this holy war should watch the BBC documentary The Power of Nightmares. Its the most accurate history of Islamic fundamentalism and neo-conservatism I’ve yet seen.
hmoffsuite on September 08 at 8:37 a.m.
Sis >> “In hmoff’s world one Muslim is just like any other and therefore all are guilty for the crimes of a few. That’s a fundamentalist viewpoint if ever there was one. And the fundamentalists will destroy us.”

In Sis’s world, one crazy preacher that wants to burn the Quran makes all guilty for the hatred of a few. I think the act is despicable.
toadman on September 08 at 8:59 a.m.
“…one crazy preacher that wants to burn the Quran makes all guilty for the hatred of a few. I think the act is despicable.”

At last, you’re right, HMO…well, if it were worded more clearly, I think. What you’re trying to say, though, is right; it does not follow that the act of hatred of the one, or the few, equates to a complete picture of the belief system of the many. You may actually kinda “get” it. ( we can only hope )

But let me clarify where you are talking in circles to Sis, by reversing your statement:

“..one crazy [group] that wants to [fly planes into buildings killing innocent people] makes all guilty for the hatred of a few.”

See? It flows both ways. We cannot blame Islam on 9/11. Islam is not the enemy, it never was, and never will be. Muslim people are as welcome and as protected under the United States constitution as Christians, Jews, Hindu, etc. etc.. Blaming all of Islam on the hateful and deadly act of a radical splinter group, is the same as blaming all Christians for every act of violence perpetrated by the many Christian radical splinter groups. Thinking people understand that it’s more complex than that. I don’t blame Catholics for the murder of innocent children at the Murrah building because Timothy McVeigh was a catholic, do you? I don’t even blame the Catholic church for what seems to be an epidemic of pedophile priests. It just doesn’t make sense to me.
fortboise on September 08 at 9:26 a.m.
Back in the day, children who failed to keep their underpants fully concealed were ridiculed fairly mercilessly.

And now this.

The proper response to this is ridicule, not outrage. Not sure what the equivalent of
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=15534306
for Jones is, but nominations are open.
deepee on September 08 at 9:51 a.m.
Sure looks like a cheap publicity stunt to me. And obviously it’s working. When’s the last time HBO has had 30+ posts on a single thread?
Burning a Quran won’t incite crazy and violent people to become crazy and violent, ‘cuz they’re already there. What it will suggest to our Muslim population is that American Christendom is ready to meet intolerance with intolerance. Not a good thing for either faith.
Sisyphus on September 08 at 9:52 a.m.
Not really hmoff. And I reckon that’s where I’m missing when making the point. Most of use here in the United States recognize that this is a violent intolerant act by a religious fanatic and that most Americans are not like him. Unfortunately there are far more ignorant uneducated people in the Middle East where hopelessness rules their world who are more than willing to believe this to be an act of religious war, because the reading and writing lessons they receive are from the mullahs who espouse these views. Those are fertile recruiting areas for fundamentalism and their prospects are enhanced by this action.

I applaud the efforts of other churches to condemn this event. But unfortunately this same fundamentalist viewpoint also has a toehold and tremendous potential in the United States as this movie demonstrates.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RNfL6IVWCE

Both sides think God is on their side in the efforts to destroy the godless enemy and willing to undertake lethal confrontation. Its the moderates caught in the middle who are the potential victims and I’ll be damned if they’re going to use the government established by the constitution to carry out their holy war. Yes he may very well have the first amendment right to burn that Koran as an act of speech but he has to ignore the spirit and intent of the remainder of the first amendment to do so.

Nice write up Chuckles. I agree with most of it.
moscow_minidoka on September 08 at 10:39 a.m.
I dunno. I really think the appropriate response to this is ridicule, not anger. An outpouring of public humiliation would be more appropriate than trying to stop this nutjob.

I’m made uneasy by the notion (even if it’s true) that we should all restrict our freedom of speech based on what a United States General thinks. What’s next - canceling peace marches because the military thinks it would hurt morale?

Let this dipstick burn the Koran, and hold a counter-protest across the street. Yes, this activity will probably induce more terrorism against the U.S., but that’s the price we pay for freedom of speech. And hopefully, there will be plenty of speech directed at this moron.
toadman on September 08 at 11:08 a.m.
I’d like to see more of the speech directed at this moron come from high profile Tea party members and other right wing pundits…

Of course, they may have been outspoken against him already, but I don’t really pay much attention anymore.

Still, if Sarah Failin or Glenn Schmuck, or even Good ‘Ole Dubya would come out with a statement against this act, it would probably help.

Again, maybe they have…but I’ve not seen it yet.
jreighley on September 08 at 1:58 p.m.
Any chance this guy will get bit by one of his rattlesnakes before Saturday?

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D.F. Oliveria is a columnist and blogger for The Spokesman-Review. Huckleberries Online was judged the best 2008 Idaho newspaper blog by the Idaho Press Club. And the best 2007 news blog in the Pacific Northwest by the Society for Professional Journalist. Print Huckleberries is a past winner of the Herb Caen Memorial Column contest by the National Association of Newspaper Columnists. The Readership Institute of Northwestern University cited this blog as a good example of online community journalism.