Spokane7
62°
April 11, 2010 in City
Health care reform may ease shortage of local physicians
Cantwell, doctors point out incentives in new law
Spokane medical educators and U.S. Sen. Maria Cantwell say health care reform can help ease the shortage of doctors in Eastern Washington.
During a Saturday news conference called to highlight an often-overlooked part of the sweeping and controversial new law, Cantwell said there are now federal incentives to help build a four-year medical school in Spokane, along with the ability to double the number of medical residencies.
Broadening medical education has been a priority of regional lawmakers and the medical and business community. Studies say Eastern Washington will need between 640 and 1,000 new doctors within 15 years.
Cantwell and Dr. John McCarthy, president of Washington Academy of Family Physicians, said that a medical school and more residencies are the key to solving the shortage – especially the need for more family-practice doctors.
Such physicians are apt to live and practice within 50 miles of where they had their residencies.
If Spokane could bolster the number of residencies, they said, it would go a long way to reversing the stubborn problem of getting doctors into small towns.
Dr. Chris Olson, a pediatrician, said Spokane has half the children’s doctors it needs.
“We have about 35 general pediatricians in Spokane, and we really need about 70 to serve a region our size,” he said.
Spokane has enough pediatric specialists – about 70 – but must find a way to attract more general pediatricians.
As an example, Olson said, about 12,000 children were brought to the emergency room at Providence Holy Family Hospital last year. Of those, just 200 were admitted to the hospital.
Such numbers point to an unfortunate scenario: Too many children and families do not have a doctor.
Olson noted that there isn’t a single pediatrician practicing in the Hillyard or West Central neighborhoods, where poor families may lack insurance and reliable transportation to visit a doctor.
Cantwell said the federal health care reform has several incentives to attract more medical students to practice primary medicine rather than higher-paying and more-esteemed specialty fields.
One is a 10 percent bonus for five years, and another is increasing the Medicaid reimbursements.
Adding more primary care doctors is seen as a way to hold down health care spending by avoiding unnecessary hospitalizations and emphasizing preventive care.
Cantwell sits on the Senate Finance Committee and had a hand in drafting and amending the health care reform bill.
Her press conference at Washington State University-Spokane did not attract protests by people upset with health reform.
White House honoree boasts roots in Colville 
spokanada on April 11 at 8:22 a.m.
Awwww SNAP! Teabaggers, how are you going to spin this?
spokanada on April 11 at 8:23 a.m.
Oh yeah, I forgot. Doctors are educated and educated people are elitists and elitists make you feel uncomfortable because they can read and such.
leekinny on April 11 at 8:53 a.m.
The more people see what’s in it the more they will like it. But, will they see that their Republican leaders lied to them about what’s in it ? The GOP didn’t lie to me, our anyone left of center, they lied to their own people who they want votes from. How much respect do you think they have for those they scared with lies ? I would think very little.
spokanada on April 11 at 9:18 a.m.
and there is the spin. Not original, but copy and pasted. I guess we should tell Obama that we are happy in Spokane with doctor shortages and that we don’t need his help.
spokanada on April 11 at 9:20 a.m.
I guess the copy and paste approach proves you can read but does little to show you are capable of independent thought.
Another_Perspective on April 11 at 9:23 a.m.
Who says there is a shortage?
Olson is inflating the numbers since he wants to start his own clinic.
spokanada on April 11 at 9:26 a.m.
where does it say Olsen wants to start his own clinic?
Spokane will need 1000 new doctors by 2025 http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2010/feb/27/doctor-shortage-foreseen/?print-friendly
misjustice on April 11 at 9:26 a.m.
GO, Senator Cantwell! A medical college is a perfect compliment to the other fine learning institutions that we have here! Now, let’s get building! ; )
force_vector on April 11 at 9:48 a.m.
If it sounds too good to be true, it likely is. Besides retail, the health care industry is the biggest employer around here. If that get’s screwed up, Spokane is in serious trouble. Blindly accepting as truth the words of an overly optomistic saleswoman isn’t good practice in any aspect of life. If these changes tank the regional economy due to consequences unforseen by the supporters, how many doctors do you think will want to come here? Think before you support, and if you must support, be skeptical.
leekinny on April 11 at 9:50 a.m.
I said…
But, will they see that their Republican leaders lied to them about what’s in it ?
It doesn’t look like it.
Ninch on April 11 at 10:03 a.m.
Obamacare does not address the problem of existing doctors not accepting Medicare and Medicaid patients, which is a big problem in Eastern Washington/Spokane… and Obamacare cuts back on Medicare payments and preventative care (i.e. Medicare Advantage) and adds more people to Medicaid, which makes things worse.
BTW: Building a medical school in Spokane did not require the takeover of the health insurance industry by Obamacare that requires mandatory purchase of a private product/service.
Just because some good stuff is included in Obamacare legislation does not make it good legislation.
spokanada on April 11 at 10:10 a.m.
The author of that article also disputes global warming.
He is a member of the American Council of Science and Healthhttp://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=American_Council_on_Science_and_Health
and a member of the Heartland Institute http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Heartland_Institute
I know he is Harvard Educated but this guy is as corrupt as they come. Next time do your research when you choose to cite someones work.
misjustice on April 11 at 10:12 a.m.
And just because the bill is not “perfect” does not mean that it is the enemy of the good!
spokanada on April 11 at 10:15 a.m.
sorry the link wasn’t proper. http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=American_Council_on_Science_and_Health
Both those institutions are backed by the tobacco industry. So why should I read an article against Obamacare by some guy who is backed by Big Tobacco?
Furthermore, why do you read his article’s. It would be like looking to Rush Limbaugh for diet advice.
Scoutster on April 11 at 10:19 a.m.
One way that this legislation works to lower costs over the long-run (the trajectory of health care spending) is to put incentives on the preventive and primary end.
You already pay for the uninsured…many of those 200,000 mentioned in the article were uninsured and never paid. Since there is no tooth fairy, it means those of us WITH insurance paid for them.
Working to have more people insured and working to have more primary care providers are both policies that will reduce costs for all of us.
Gene_Colburn on April 11 at 10:30 a.m.
I wonder if Maria Cantwell even read the bill. I have. The final house version. This is the biggest confiscation of wealth and freedom ever enacted by our elected leaders. You who have drank the Kool-aid will be cursing this bill in time. We are broke as a nation. What don’t you understand about that? This atrocity that Cantwell claims will bring new facilities and doctors to Spokane is a boondoggle of unprecedented proportion. It will however create hundreds of thousands or more government jobs. You as a taxpayer will have to pay for it. Hence as Volker and Gethner imply a new federal value added tax is being proposed to help pay for this monster. The secretary of health is now the new health care czar and will enforce your health care options. That is a given in this bill. She also has the power to direct funding to and for which ever health care needs she or he sees fit as the most needy of support. Your tax dollars will be spent helping those not in your own communities as it should but most likely will go to LA, NY, Chicago, etc. where the biggest blocks of people exist.
edmitch on April 11 at 10:32 a.m.
How many comment posters here have actually read the bill or read the Congressional Budget Office analysis of the bills?
The most detailed analysis appears in this November 30, 2009 analysis of the then Senate bill: http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/107xx/doc10781/11-30-Premiums.pdf
Contrary to statements made by both Murray and Cantwell claiming that the bills lower premiums for everyone (which is an outright lie), the CBO has found that those individuals and families who have been responsibly purchasing their own insurance policies will see sharp rises in their costs of health care. Many non-group policies are true insurance, not pre-paid high benefit programs. Because true insurance plans are eliminated. non-group purchasers will be forced to buy high benefit/high premium pre-paid policies approximately doubling their costs. And even though non-group buyers will pay the same costs as group (and corporate) buyers, they will receive far less benefit payouts.
Separately, the CBO estimated that families making more than $88,000 per year will have to spend up to $20,000 per year for health care under the final bill. For this group there are no subsidies, no tax credits nor are the premiums tax deductible. Stated another way, let’s say you earned $88,000 and paid about $15,000 in taxes, leaving $73,000. The CBO estimates you’ll have to pay up to $20,000 for health care under this program or more than 25% of your take home pay. By law, you will be required to spend more than 25% of take home pay on health care. Now add in housing, transportation, food, etc.
The CBO further estimates that overall costs of health care will rise due to increased demand for services paid for by someone else.
Harvard economist Greg Mankiw notes that for those making less money, such as about $30,000 per year, the bill provides a generous subsidy. However, as the family’s income rises to say $40,000 per year, the combination of the decline in the subsidy for health insurance plus moving in to higher tax brackets results in a marginal tax rate of more than 100%. What that means: In that narrow range, for each additional dollar you earn, you will owe more than $1 in taxes and health insurance costs. What a mess.
Former Lt Gov Garamundi, of California, and formerly that state’s insurance commissioner noted that the way the mandate is structured, and without a so called “public” option, those in the non-group market will be “thrown to the sharks” in the insurance industry.
The bills do virtually nothing to address waste, malpractice, tort reform, inefficiency and ineffectiveness or excess and unnecessary demands on health care paid for by someone else.
The bill can be summarized as “Health care costs too much so let’s spread the costs around to more people.”
The are many other issues in the bill that will result in unintended consequences. There is not room here to present all of those.
I urge you to study the bill and the CBO analysis (there were several reports).
Yes, there are “winners” under this bill but there are also many who lose and will find themselves undergoing gut wrenching life decisions to cope with the need to spend 25% or more of their take home pay on high premium/high benefit pre-paid health care.
This bill was hardly the best that could be done.
misjustice on April 11 at 10:37 a.m.
leekinny, Looks like the answer to your question is, “NO!”
johnclarke on April 11 at 10:59 a.m.
edmitch, nice example of cherry picking “data” from multiple sources. Would you kindly provide the page numbers from the CBO report that supports (any) of your data?
johnclarke on April 11 at 11:13 a.m.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/5-Overblown-Fears-About-usnews-1662044017.html?x=0
force_vector on April 11 at 11:30 a.m.
Edmitch just provided data from a credible entity to justify his position on this matter. Since when did that become “cherry picking”? And why does he also need to provide a page number? Read the report and find the page number on your own, or else you too would be guilty of “cherry picking”. The dedication to supporting something you don’t even understand is purely political. Reasonable minds understand that when a politician talks of how great something will be, there is inevitably a flip side. The flip side should always be the initial focus. I could drive 100 miles per hour to work and be there in 10 minutes. Awesome! The flip side is a ticket that costs me more than that days wage. We calculate the ratio of negatives to positives every day in our lives. Why can’t some people do the same for this bill? There may be good things in it, but do they out weigh the negatives. Do you really have enough information to know? Probably not. So stop defending something for identification with a political group that may turn out to be a horrible idea in the long run. Nothing is “free”, so use your head. If someone makes a good point, at least consider it and be prepared to change your opinion in the face of overwhelming evidence should you see it. An inability to do so means you have deferred your personal identity and freedom of thought to someone else.
leekinny on April 11 at 11:31 a.m.
Thanks johnclarke
I stole the link.
More “overwrought fearmongering”, is where were headed no matter what legislation they decide to take up.
misjustice on April 11 at 11:47 a.m.
“Reasonable minds understand that when a politician talks of how great something will be, there is inevitably a flip side…”
And other reasonable minds understand that when people parrott how bad something will be, there is inevitably a flip side..
The good side.
JBlim on April 11 at 11:49 a.m.
fbhkymom: Your facts are wrong, the cost of the health care law is a little under 1 trillion OVER 10 YEARS, it looks like your 150 billion is for one year. So, using your own logic, Obamacare really is about “making health care more available or affordable to those who need it and can’t afford it” after all. Feel better?
tiredofthespin on April 11 at 11:50 a.m.
Wow! Great news!!! but…. where are all the medical students going to come from? I know that I’m not going to eight years of school and then a 2 to 4 internship only to make $30 to $60 an hour. If the best of the best won’t do it, then who will? Maybe they’ll have to lower the standards to enter, in order to fill classes, which will result in more failures, so then it’s time to lower the standards to succeed. Ten years from now we could have the “best” physicians be those that couldn’t even make it past the med school entrance requirements! Wow?, Great News???
leekinny on April 11 at 12:30 p.m.
I don’t think some on the right would accept a glass of water from a stranger, if they were dying of thirst, because ,of all the things that might by wrong with it.
misjustice on April 11 at 12:47 p.m.
leekinny, I think that “might” is the operative word, here. Geez they even oppose the opportunity of building a new institution of higher learning because it “might” not meet their oh,so,high expectations…go figure! ; )
misjustice on April 11 at 12:52 p.m.
Perhaps what the nay sayers truly fear is that the reform and a new medical teaching college might be wildly successful?
Cougardave on April 11 at 1:06 p.m.
All of us average Joes on the new medicare like government plan will get those sub-par doctors. Only those with cash to pay up front will receive quality medical care. It would be interesting to ask Dr Olson which kind of patient he prefers; medicare patients, patients with private insurance (which wont be around long), or patients who are able to pay cash for service. It’s a no brainer, we can all see what the best doctors will do.
johnclarke on April 11 at 1:18 p.m.
Force, I did read the report, and I can’t find the part about having to pay 25% of my take home pay for health care…or for that matter “The CBO further estimates that overall costs of health care will rise due to increased demand for services paid for by someone else”.
Did you read the report? ..and BTW that CBO report was based on one (Senate) version of the bill, and not the final one. You can find the up to date CBO report here.
http://www.cbo.gov/publications/collections/health.cfm
You can attack me all you want, but I’m just asking for facts and data. Like for example, I suggest you read this…. http://www.finweb.com/insurance/average-health-insurance-cost-by-country.html
The United States spends way more for health care than other industrial nations. Lots more. That would be a fact.
The standard rww response is that our health care is SO much better than other countries, right ? Yeah, maybe - if you can afford it. Anyway, when anyone is willing to discuss ACTUAL facts and data, let’s go. Otherwise “citation needed.”
Whippersnapper on April 11 at 1:26 p.m.
When the government, via the coming health care system, can tell a doctor what procedures he/she can perform on which patients and how much money can be charged, the rush of people to medical school will slow to a trickle. Especially for specialists like neurology, cardiology and orthopedics, where the docs will still be exposed to huge legal liabilities. And we get to enjoy the benefits of resulting mediocrity. Thanks, Koolaid drinkers.
When the actual cost of the new healthcare system breaks two trillion, and it will, then then six years of benefits won’t look like $150B per year, it will look like $300-$400B per year. And Obama spent 1.56 trillion more than we had in the last year alone.
The people who designed this system are liars and/or willfully ignorant of what they have wrought. God help us.
bdr on April 11 at 2:00 p.m.
AT LAST! WE HAVE SOLVED THE SEARCH FOR WMD!
(Washington Medical Doctors!)
thanks for finally finding it Mr Obama!
MrNatural on April 11 at 2:04 p.m.
Most folks if not frankly all of them don’t know a damn thing about health care reform or what it will do…including me…why in hell can’t we have a little faith…think positive…and hope all works out for the best…time will tell…and any glitches will be amended…Cripes what a bunch of malcontents…
liarsinnews on April 11 at 2:15 p.m.
Thanks to Gene Colburn, edmitch, John Clarke, and Whippersnapper for your common sense and knowledge about the Obamacare rip off plus showing proof re the bill. I`m in the 53% who pay a federal income taxes. I don`t earn a lot of money but still file and pay income tax every year which I`ve done for over 60 years. I pay an arm and a leg for my supplemental BC &BS increased every year to help those without insurance. I can`t afford to pay more with the proposed US plan. I`ll be redundant, God help us!
Another_Perspective on April 11 at 2:52 p.m.
misjustice should quit using a speculum as a tongue depressor.
Barcroft on April 11 at 3:08 p.m.
I know! Let’s all gather together and shake hands—at the opening of the new medical school. Then again when the first class graduates!
I doubt we’ll ever meet.
It’s called “pipe dreams and promises”.
leekinny on April 11 at 4:06 p.m.
Cougardave said….
Only those with cash to pay up front will receive quality medical care.
Then he goes on to assume many negative things about doctors.
I happen to think much more highly of Doctors than many on the right do. There’s always an idiot or two out there, as is frequently displayed by media looking to exploit such weakness, but they do not represent the integrity of our medical professionals here in Spokane..
Doctors step up to the plate when called upon to do so. They will continue to do just that.
This bill isn’t as good or as strong or as complete as it will be because of conservative obstruction from Republicans and a small handful of Democrats.
We will continue, despite your best efforts, to improve upon the good.
misjustice on April 11 at 4:48 p.m.
leekinny, I must agree with your comments regarding the quality of the health care providers in our region. We are fortunate to have first rate, high caliber, professionals practicing at our local hospitals and clinics.
Additionally,many give back to the community; donating their hours and expertise to worthwhile organizations such as Project Access which helps those without insurance or in low income brackets get needed care.
A medical college would be a perfect compliment to the many fine health care providers this area already has; and I’m sure that many doctors, nurses, and others in the health care field would welcome the opportunites that a medial college would bring to Spokane.
leekinny on April 11 at 5:05 p.m.
Now, it’s time to move ahead. Whether, it’s much needed banking regulation, fully funding and strengthening our employee and consumer safety regulatory agencies, SCOTUS nominee, nuclear treaty or immigration it is time for the US to move ahead. Progressives aren’t going to be happy with all the results, as others, within the party, won’t be comfortable with numerous conservative compromises. But, in the end we will come together while the Conservatives will stand divided, only united in their use of ‘NO’.
leekinny on April 11 at 5:10 p.m.
misjustice , You are absolutely right. This would bring great growth to our community.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 6:59 p.m.
I’ve read the bill…and get it’s updates as they’re continuing to modify it. Bill still isn’t finished. CBO is always given the number by the majority party…in this case the Dems. What was not given to them was the interests cost on the $950 Billion. Done to NOT get to the Trillion dollar figure Obama hates.
If interest costs are added in, the Bill goes to $1.4 trillion over 10 years…and that’s if things stay as they are NOW. They never are static. If the rate of growth of healthcare is factored in…the cost well exceeds $2.5 trillion. It’s a bad bill and those who clamored for it won’t like it when they find out about what’s in it. No matter the Obama propaganda, it’s just too underpowered. All this when nearly half the country won’t be paying any income tax within 1 year. Non sustainable…
And as for a local 4 year med school, twice this has been rejected. I don’t see what’s different now….except to produce new Docs will flood an already saturated market. In terms of MD’s 1000’s of population, Spokane is way out front. Silly to note that not one general pediatrician is in Hillyard or West Central….making it sound like it’s a 3 day trip to go find one. Ahem….maybe this MD would notice that it doesn’t matter if one is still only 2 to 3 miles away. My God these people must realise that the population can think…well misjustice exempted. Plus there’s a screening “doc in the ” about every 5 minutes on Division…the Valley, etc. Amazing plethora of healthcare options in the Spokane County.
tiredofthespin on April 11 at 7:50 p.m.
I have 21 years as a federal employee. I have the experience to say the federal government is, for the most part, incompetent! Social Security, Medicare and the Dept. of Homeland Security…. all gigantic black holes, sucking our country dry.
What is another couple of trillion…. $1,000,000,000,000.00 or start counting seconds… you’ll reach one trillion in 31546 years!
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 7:59 p.m.
Correction…”In terms of MD’s 1000’s of population, Spokane is way out front.”…Should read…”MD’s /1000’s of population”.. D
leekinny on April 11 at 8:19 p.m.
Didn’t someone here say they would be at the next tea party carrying the sign ‘End Medicare and Social Security’ ?
Anyway it’s on to the next challenge!
liarsinnews on April 11 at 8:25 p.m.
I`m so glad tiredofthespin posted his/her comment. I have never said all government employees deserve to be painted with the same brush. Seems to me, if all government employees were as honest to speak the truth as tiredofthespin did, the citizens would be much better off than we are now. Thanks, tiredofthespin!! I`ll wager you earn your salary.
misjustice on April 11 at 8:25 p.m.
leekinny, keep fighting the GOOD fight! We’ll get there, my friend! : )
spokanada on April 11 at 8:41 p.m.
Dick it would be best if the goverment kept their hands off of health care and the banks etc but they were forced to intervene after free market capitalism failed yet again.
Thayne on April 11 at 8:41 p.m.
Another_Perspective on April 11 at 2:52 p.m.
misjustice should quit using a speculum as a tongue depressor.
Hey Another_Perspective have you heard the old saying - If you don’t have something nice to say - shut up. I might have paraphrased it. Everyone else on this blog was expressing their opinions intelligently about the topic but you displayed your usual crude, rude and moronic behavior. Don’t you have some educational television (in your case I’m guessing, professional wrestling or your “Girls Gone Wild” DVDs) to watch instead of being insulting here?
mdriftmeyer on April 11 at 8:50 p.m.
To my fellow WSU alum, the BioMedical University is already in the design phase.
For now, the Biomedical Engineering buildings are in phase I with the rerouting of road designs going in place this spring to end of summer. Riverpoint Campus is going to be booming.
http://www.cpd.wsu.edu/CPDProjects/project.aspx?Value=3111
The full blown Medical University proposal has already gone through several phases of feasibility studies and outside consulting firms agree that it’s critical to have it.
http://www.wsunews.wsu.edu/pages/publications.asp?Action=Detail&PublicationID=18555&PageID=94
========
Now if we can get more advanced mechanical engineering and computer science R&D locally I’d be a happy camper.
Sauce on April 11 at 9:28 p.m.
Nice “truthiness”, Daisy. Just because you happen to see a lot of doctors’ offices, of course there is a surplus of doctors here. Nice research. Now, from the people who actually cared to do a methodical, well-reasoned approach—
“The study prepared by officials from UW, Washington State University, Spokane hospitals and businesses says that, even at its maximum of 100 students per year, the expanded school will provide only 9 percent of the 4,100 doctors Eastern Washington must have to care for a bigger, older population in 2025. And that assumes a ratio of doctors to patients much lower than the national average, outside Spokane, Walla Walla and Chelan counties.”—Spokesman-Review
And “CBO is always given the number”? WTF does that mean? What number? The CBO is non-partisan, and they aren’t just “given a number” by the majority party. They carefully read the legislation and attempt to extrapolate, as best they or anyone else can, what the legislation’s financial impact will be. Are you really suggesting that if Congress doesn’t specifically tell the CBO that interest, in fact, exists, that the CBO wouldn’t figure it out?
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 9:43 p.m.
Sauce..no offense . CBO is bound to use only the data given to it by the party in charge (Dems) of the house.. Whether they can count the interest…it doesn’t matter. The CBO can indeed calculate the accrued interest. It’s not in the report. I read it and wondered where the interest money was. It’s just not there. Go read it for yourself….you likely cannot understand it. I can tell you haven’t read it or you wouldn’t comment. Very inaccurate comment.
Where’s Obama getting the money to fund this plan? US and China…
And yes I do know exactly the number of Docs here…exactly to a man. Sp Co Medical Society knows…and it’s shared that. WSU, UW and the hopitals drum up problems and then sove them…it’s how business is done for them. There’s no shortage now and the 2025 figures are prepared by them. Whether they are correct projections is anybody’s best guess.
Now..grow a brain and run along. Nice try though.
misjustice on April 11 at 9:57 p.m.
Sauce, I think that I can add to Daisy’s argument…so that you and others can more fully understand just what it is that she is attempting to say,
Here, from some of her past rants, culled from her past posts on the SR Blogs…enjoy!
“it’s not good to have a spending wildman in the White House…..them thar Dims git everythings for free.. we have a virtual madman at the helm.. this little pretender in the WH. The rest of the world doesn’t trust Obama. They shouldn’t. Tyranny breeds this. Tyranny… That’s tyranny. Obama loves it.
Obama was elected by a majority.. despotic abuse of authority….. people don’t like tyranny;) I know one when I see one…..he’s a Socialist. Tyranny only goes so far. arbitrary or unrestrained exercise of power. Tyrannical Socialism is one step back from the Russia of old.
America seems to be waking up after 14.5 months of tyranny…. I cannot imagine Obama surviving given the tenor of his first year. disfavor of the Obama… he plotted for the Presidency. Dreams from the faux messiah. In America, you’re on your own.
He concealed, shucked, bobbed and weaved until his own pride and inexperience have lifted the veil on this “wonderkind”. Terrible days ahead for America. Communists/Socialists love this type of thing… Obama will take what he wants. Obama is an idealogue. I’m not a caucasian goofy.. obama takes over. do whatever’s necessary to control citizens. and most of his work has been directed at tearing down the Constitution by any and every means
Obama has never been in the real world of work. he is trying to make his vision work… Jobs matter to him so he can notch an accomplishment and be re-elected. He’s fled reality complete liberal socialist Communists/Socialists love this type of thing….it cripples production, jobs, etc. It’s a version of mayhem….and what follows is…..??? Guess! Wake America….”they’re here”… and obama takes over
Next up: Immigration…he’ll try to buy their votes too. a version of mayhem… control citizens and push his ideas throughwhy they’re angry. Is it a sign of the Obama times? He won’t save you…..Don’t be so angry you can be rewarded too…..In Obama’s America Everyone should be the same (except him and his chosen helpers)… It’s garbage people. why so angry? you’re out of sortswhat’s up with your anger
The rest of the world doesn’t trust Obama. They shouldn’t. them thar Dims git everythings for free.. this new “peacock”…. we have a virtual madman at the helm this little pretender in the WH Tyranny… Obamacare. ignored the will of the people. people don’t like tyranny;) I know one when I see one…..he’s a Socialist. That’s tyranny. Obama loves it. And don’t patronize me. Stick to the facts and you might make a point worth considering. america seems to be waking up after 14.5 months of tyranny Tyrannical Socialism
Dreams from the faux messiah Obama will take what he wants Obama is an idealogue I’m not a caucasian goofy..I do have common sense though obama takes over If you ever read something instead of just mouthing off, you might be close to literate..not smart but conversant with some intelligence added in. Obama has never been in the real world tearing down the Constitution by any and every means.
Obama shucked, bobbed and weaved this imposter wildman in the White House…..them thar Dims git everythings for free.. this new “peacock”…. a virtual madman this little pretender in the WH Obama was elected by a majority Tyranny breeds this That’s tyranny. Obama loves it. And don’t patronize me. the will of the people. people don’t like tyranny;) I know one when I see one…..he’s a Socialist.”
Did I leave anything out, Dazee?
Sauce on April 11 at 9:59 p.m.
Daisy—Pure Fiction! Before you go making up things (or most likely repeating misinformation) about the CBO, do your homework! From the CBO web site, regarding the sources of their information—
“CBO uses the rich data sources available from the government’s statistical agencies. Those sources include the national income and product accounts, the census of manufacturers, the Statistics of Income, the Current Population Survey, and various national health surveys. CBO also uses information provided by relevant government agencies and industry groups to meet specific needs. To answer some questions, CBO uses available analytic models or develops them on its own.
CBO employs standard methods of economic analysis and closely follows professional developments in economics and related disciplines. CBO frequently seeks outside experts’ advice on specific analytic matters, such as the outlook for agriculture production, spending projections for Medicare and Medicaid, and business prospects in the telecommunications industry. For its economic forecasts, CBO draws on the advice of a distinguished panel of advisers that meets twice a year.
All CBO estimates and analytic products are reviewed internally for technical competence, accuracy of data, and clarity of exposition. CBO studies also are reviewed by outside experts, Although outside advisers provide considerable assistance, CBO is solely responsible for the accuracy of the estimates and analyses that it produces. In keeping with its nonpartisan status and its mandate to provide objective analysis, CBO does not make policy recommendations in any of its analyses.”
When politicians, from either party, disagree publicly with the CBO, it is usually motivated more by politics than facts.
Sauce on April 11 at 10:05 p.m.
misjustice—thank you for the historical piece/insight into Daisy’s psyche. I would, however, prefer to stay on topic and deal only with her comments on this article. No offense to you, misjustice, but I don’t seek to discredit or dismiss Daisy’s ideas and opinions. I only want to have a reasoned discussion, within the guidelines and standards of this forums. On that note, Daisy, I believe the “grow a brain” and the “you likely cannot understand it” ad hominem comments were outside the bounds of civility and reasoned discourse. You begin your comment with “no offense” and toss offhand insults like we’re panelists on the O’Reilly Factor. Granted, I offered some edgy criticisms, but only in regard to your comments, not your intelligence in general.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 10:09 p.m.
misj has several qoutes of mine. She follows me around. She has the brains of a minnow on a good day. Not one original post. She’s just a lil ankle biter liberal who cheers for things that sound good but she doesn’t understand. Isn’t she cute.
All she can do try to be a lil bit nasty when someone diverges from her very limited views. She’s nothing. She couldn’t fashion a thoughtful post if she was paid for it. But she’s cute….
misjustice on April 11 at 10:15 p.m.
And to drive Dazee’s “points” home…from her brilliant past posts on the SR Blogs, she, a “learned” woman, that doesn’t miss the chance to deride other posters that oppose her scathing views of current political commentary says the following…
“it’s not good to have a spending wildman in the White House…..them thar Dims git everythings for free.. we have a virtual madman at the helm.. this little pretender in the WH. The rest of the world doesn’t trust Obama. They shouldn’t. Tyranny breeds this. Tyranny… That’s tyranny. Obama loves it.
Obama was elected by a majority.. despotic abuse of authority….. people don’t like tyranny;) I know one when I see one…..he’s a Socialist. Tyranny only goes so far. arbitrary or unrestrained exercise of power. Tyrannical Socialism is one step back from the Russia of old.
America seems to be waking up after 14.5 months of tyranny…. I cannot imagine Obama surviving given the tenor of his first year. disfavor of the Obama… he plotted for the Presidency. Dreams from the faux messiah. In America, you’re on your own.
He concealed, shucked, bobbed and weaved until his own pride and inexperience have lifted the veil on this “wonderkind”. Terrible days ahead for America. Communists/Socialists love this type of thing… Obama will take what he wants. Obama is an idealogue. I’m not a caucasian goofy.. obama takes over. do whatever’s necessary to control citizens. and most of his work has been directed at tearing down the Constitution by any and every means
Obama has never been in the real world of work. he is trying to make his vision work… Jobs matter to him so he can notch an accomplishment and be re-elected. He’s fled reality complete liberal socialist Communists/Socialists love this type of thing….it cripples production, jobs, etc. It’s a version of mayhem….and what follows is…..??? Guess! Wake America….”they’re here”… and obama takes over
Next up: Immigration…he’ll try to buy their votes too. a version of mayhem… control citizens and push his ideas throughwhy they’re angry. Is it a sign of the Obama times? He won’t save you…..Don’t be so angry you can be rewarded too…..In Obama’s America Everyone should be the same (except him and his chosen helpers)… It’s garbage people. why so angry? you’re out of sortswhat’s up with your anger
The rest of the world doesn’t trust Obama. They shouldn’t. them thar Dims git everythings for free.. this new “peacock”…. we have a virtual madman at the helm this little pretender in the WH Tyranny… Obamacare. ignored the will of the people. people don’t like tyranny;) I know one when I see one…..he’s a Socialist. That’s tyranny. Obama loves it. And don’t patronize me. Stick to the facts and you might make a point worth considering. america seems to be waking up after 14.5 months of tyranny Tyrannical Socialism
Dreams from the faux messiah Obama will take what he wants Obama is an idealogue I’m not a caucasian goofy..I do have common sense though obama takes over If you ever read something instead of just mouthing off, you might be close to literate..not smart but conversant with some intelligence added in. Obama has never been in the real world tearing down the Constitution by any and every means.
Obama shucked, bobbed and weaved this imposter wildman in the White House…..them thar Dims git everythings for free.. this new “peacock”…. a virtual madman this little pretender in the WH Obama was elected by a majority Tyranny breeds this That’s tyranny. Obama loves it. And don’t patronize me. the will of the people. people don’t like tyranny;) I know one when I see one…..he’s a Socialist. ”
She’s not racist or partisan, as these comments clearly demonstrate!
She, alone is intelligent; oh, and fair and balanced, also!
misjustice on April 11 at 10:21 p.m.
Sauce, I commend your attempts to stay on thread and also have found value in your comments. Please forgive my youthful replies to Dazee, I have found that it is impossible to have a thoughtful debate with her; as can be had with other posters.
Sometimes, like my momma told me, “you have to smack a bully right back in the face”, and with Dazee and her repeated past attacks on me (and insincere apoligies) that is how I have chosen, in my youthful way, to respond to her attacks.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 10:31 p.m.
Well misj…you offer nothing to anyone. I’m sure you’re well intended…but whenever someone posts and it’s not quite inline with your shallow notions, you attack. Me? I just tell it like it is and from vast experience. You don’t like it. No worries. Just post away. Dear, when you post something original unlike you never have, I’ll respond cogently. You, so far, just cheer on someone else…nothing to add even. You just chirp chirp chirp.
I apologised to you last week…but you continue attacks. So I guess there can be no peace with you. So I just post and you just chirp. Have at it. But when it comes to a large array of concepts, I’ll be there. I’m trained…and you…well…I wish you well in your education. Chirp chirp chirp….
Sauce on April 11 at 10:44 p.m.
For Daisy and misjustice—three quotes to think on:
“If there are twelve clowns in a ring, you can jump in the middle and start reciting Shakespeare, but to the audience, you’ll just be the thirteenth clown”—Adam Walinsky
“I let no man drag me down so low as to make me hate him.”—Booker T. Washington
“We can disagree without being disagreeable.”—Barack Obama
misjustice on April 11 at 10:49 p.m.
Dazee Trader, you are a bully, pure and simple. I never directed any comments your way, and yet,,,,here you are on this thread - posted above…
Daisy Minken on April 11 at 6:59 p.m.
My God these people must realise that the population can think…well misjustice exempted.
I will not take your pathetic attempts at bullying and not respond to you. Many other posters can engage in a vigorous, even heated debate, without making personal attacks on the commentator. But not you. I have learned from your past, unwarrented, unfounded attacks on me that the only way to shut you up is to slam you with your own pearls of wisdom…because trying to be the bigger person got me no where - you just slung mud at me all the more…
Next up, a collection of all the mean, personal attacks that you have lobbed…just to further make my point.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 10:49 p.m.
I don’t need a referree Sauce… let’s keep it to the topic at hand. No distractions please…let’s stay on topic.
Sauce on April 11 at 10:58 p.m.
Daisy, I would love it if you would. Regarding my last on-topic comment, the CBO is in fact not required to use the Democratic party as their sole source of information. And the reason there is no interest included in the CBO estimates is because they have estimated that the health care legislation will reduce the deficit. I have heard this assertion attacked many times, in many forums. However, I have yet to see a critic offer empirical evidence to back up their claims of “funny math”, “bias”, or “just plain wrong” aimed at the CBO.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 11:01 p.m.
“When undertaking a cost estimate, CBO analysts contact the staff of the committee of jurisdiction and, when applicable, the staffs of the Member sponsoring the proposal and the Member requesting the estimate to gather background information and discuss the schedule for completing the estimate. Budget and mandate cost estimates are based on the text of the proposed legislation. CBO analysts consult with the staff of the committee of jurisdiction (for a reported bill) or the sponsoring Member (for an introduced bill or amendment) when questions of interpretation arise, but they draw their own conclusions on an impartial and objective basis. ”
From CBO.org…how estimates of cost are made. Happy now Sauce?
The “jurisdiction” is the ruling party’s committee. have fun reading. I’m this should enlighten you. I’m surprised you would write such uniformed opinions. Sobeit though….others ( ahem) do it all the time right misj?
misjustice on April 11 at 11:11 p.m.
• “As for misj…isn’t she a delightful lil cheerleader… bet she has bows in her hair too. Vacuous under her shiny bows but she’s a shiny, bubbly example. Her reading comprehensive lacks but she thinks she’s clever so she continuous her empty banter. We humor her…like we do chipmunks…at Christmas when Alvin makes his annual appearance. She says she has a job. I bet her paper route is thrilling!! ’
“Such a little patronizing, uninformed girl”
• “misj…grow a brain. He likely has had enough of people like yo without insurance who live off the taxpayers’ dime. You cannot seem to understand how vile oBamas plan is. Empty headed comments won’t do. Think before you post. He is standing on principle….something that has obviously escaped you.”
“Scout..I see you’ve picked up a sidekick. misj is a formidable lil ankle biter to be sure. Well done”
“In Wa St as in other states, the tilt to the left is over for one big reason…: We cannot afford profligate spending ( feel free to look it up misj).”
“misjyou cannot think for yourself. Covering me is a sincere form of flattery.. so thanx.”
• “Yes I have a bit more though……. your goofiness is like porn…Can’t quantify it but I know it when I see it…just plain ill prepared.. You’re not only a total ditz…you can’t read well either. When did you hit it the head? You don’t understand any of this…just superficial remarks…like you have a perpetual concussion.’
“You haven’t refuted one thing let alone offer a cogent thought or argument. You write things you may have heard somewhere like a jr high dance. Not one new idea or not one shred of substance…just Shirley Temple lolipop stuff.”
“I think you’re incompetent to have a conversation…feeling better now? Get thee to a high school degree please”
“Comment is irrelvant kisj. This conversation boils down to people who are in favor of free enterpise and those who aren’t.
Namecalling is a fav tool of the libs…and while it might be fun for miscreants, it down’t forward the conversation..”
Seems as if you, Dazee Trader do a lot of name calling of your own!
And this is my personal favorite,
“don’t forget to shave that unibrow don’t forget to flaunt your alleged military experience”
I especially like the part where you deride my military service; that’s brilliant! Makes me feel like the years of my life that I gave up in order serve my country, so that you could then attack me for it were totally worth it…
And so that I don’t appear to be unfair and not appreciative of your past appologies..here for old times sake, Dazee..
“• Tucky knows nothing but left wing blather. Not so far from him resides Scoutster although he can make a decent argument…
You, however..I’ve decided I owe an apology to misj. I’ve been hard on you. …remember though..it’s incumbent upon you to be smart and well spoken…and well thought out. These guys won’t help. Just remember that..it’s up to you to be an excellent young woman.
With that, I apologise to you..Best wishes.
Daisy
ps Happy Easter all my boardmates.”
You are a bully that resorts to name calling when you are losing the debate…and as long as you attempt to bully me, or attack me out of hand - even when you and I are not debating - I will make similar posts, of your own words…to make my point that your comments will be responded to…
Sauce on April 11 at 11:12 p.m.
Daisy, the quote you pasted states that the jurisdictional committee is contacted for background information and scheduling. The actual estimate is based on the text of the legislation. If something in the bill isn’t clear, they will ask the bill’s sponsor exactly what is meant. The last lines of your quote state that whatever that Congress(wo)man tells the CBO is not automatically assumed to be factual; the CBO draws their own conclusions after running the Member’s statements through what can probably be accurately described as a highly refined BS filter.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 11 at 11:18 p.m.
Go read what the whole website says….it’s all there. All the CBO is supplied with comes NOT from their own investigation. Their charge is to analyze what they’re given by the committee in question. Go read. It’s got lots of facts for you Sauce…
It’s how things work. I reviewed lots of those budgets. Be informed…you might be surprised at how flimsy the data is…if you have years of experience with data work, it just frustrating.
But go read the page on how it works. You’ll eat your words when you see it for yourself. I’m not going to do your work for you. You started it by questioning what I wrote about CBO. So man up and go get some education on it.
NOW..back to the physician shortage….you know the fabricated one?
Sauce on April 12 at 12:10 a.m.
Daisy, I already clarified the quote that you posted, which you mistakenly believed to be proof that the CBO gets their information solely from Congressional committees. As I elucidated, committees are only a source of background information and scheduling. The CBO’s statement on the sources of their information bears repeating, and I will add emphasis to each source of information that is NOT a Congressional committee, or other partisan source.
“CBO uses the rich data sources available from the government’s statistical agencies. Those sources include the NATIONAL INCOME AND PRODUCT ACCOUNTS, the CENSUS OF MANUFACTURERS, the STATISTICS OF INCOME, the CURRENT POPULATION SURVEY, and various NATIONAL HEALTH SURVEYS. CBO also uses information provided by relevant government agencies and INDUSTRY GROUPS to meet specific needs. To answer some questions, CBO uses AVAILABLE ANALYTIC MODELS or develops them ON ITS OWN.
CBO employs STANDARD METHODS of economic analysis and closely follows PROFESSIONAL DEVELOPMENTS in economics and related disciplines. CBO frequently seeks OUTSIDE EXPERT’S ADVICE on specific analytic matters, such as the outlook for agriculture production, spending projections for Medicare and Medicaid, and business prospects in the telecommunications industry. For its economic forecasts, CBO draws on the advice of a DISTINGUISHED PANEL OF ADVISERS that meets twice a year.
All CBO estimates and analytic products are reviewed internally for technical competence, accuracy of data, and clarity of exposition. CBO studies also are reviewed by OUTSIDE EXPERTS. Although outside advisers provide considerable assistance, CBO is solely responsible for the accuracy of the estimates and analyses that it produces. In keeping with its nonpartisan status and its mandate to provide objective analysis, CBO does not make policy recommendations in any of its analyses.”
Additionally, Daisy, you claim that “[The CBO’s] charge is to analyze what they’re given by the committee in question.” According to the CBO, “CBO’s mandate is to provide the Congress with: Objective, nonpartisan, and timely analyses to aid in economic and budgetary decisions on the wide array of programs covered by the federal budget and the information and estimates required for the Congressional budget process.
Also, you call the CBO’s data “flimsy”. You will find on the CBO’s Frequently Asked Questions: “How accurate are CBO’s economic forecasts?
“CBO regularly evaluates the accuracy of its economic forecasts and publishes the track record…Historically, the accuracy of CBO’s two-year forecasts and five-year projections has been very similar to the accuracy of those by the Blue Chip consensus (an average of private-sector forecasters).”
Anyone with “years of experience with data work” would be well aware of the CBO’s exemplary track record of accurate forecasts.
Since you could find nothing on the CBO’s web site to support your baseless assertions, you simply said “read the whole website.” This smacks of intellectual laziness, Daisy. If the CBO website truly does support your accusations, quote it as I have. Back up what you say with evidence, with proof. Don’t just resort to, “It’s there if you look it up, I’m right because I say I’m right, now do your research and prove me right.” No, Daisy. Prove yourself right. I have offered plenty of evidence fully discrediting your accusations about the CBO. You simply dismiss me as undereducated and try to change the subject.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 12 at 12:54 a.m.
But they didn’t include the interest. The CBO MAY have outside adviors but they may or may not listen to them. In the case of healthcare, they didn’t solicit anyone. The working group simply took the data from the Juridiction group (Dem healthcare committee….remember the other side of the isle wasn’t allow in or even to see what they were forwarding) and then made their projections based soley on what the group was given…..Sauce…perhpas you’re wee bit underpowered on this.
Let me see if I can find the actually conclusions of the group…verifying that no interest or real costs were arrived at.
But remember, your exclamations of things like “WTF” make you look simple. So hold on…let me see what additional things I can find for you. As an aside though….you didn’t read the whole set of documents….it’s pretty limited what you write above. You already seem to have your conclusions but you didn’t quote anything to defeat what I told you.
This might be like you bringing a knife to a gunfight…as my kids say.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 12 at 1:43 a.m.
I decided to give you a summary of the costs…not from CBO as I doubt you’d understandit…but here’s avery timely article from the seriously left wing New York Timmes..it’s a decent summary.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/21/opinion/21holtz-eakin.html
Sauce on April 12 at 1:45 a.m.
As I say, I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person. You continue to provide NO PROOF for the things you are stating as fact. I have provided evidence disproving your earlier facts, which you continue to ignore. I have in fact quoted many things that defeat what you told me—that CBO’s numbers are flimsy, that their only job is to work with what Congressional committees give them, that they don’t do their own investigations. They clearly describe their methodology on their website, but you claim that in the case of health care legislation they departed completely from what they usually (always) do. And, Daisy, if WTF makes me look simple … it’s “actual conclusions”, not “actually conclusions”; “Jurisdiction”, not “Juridiction”; “aisle”, not “isle”; “uninformed”, not “uniformed”; “apologized”, not “apologised”; “So be it”, not “Sobeit”; “quotes”, not “qoutes”; “realize”, not “realise”, and learn when and when not to use an apostrophe.
Sauce on April 12 at 2:17 a.m.
And, Daisy, hate to break it to you, but that NYT article is NOT a news article. See, the word “opinion” is even in the hyperlink you posted. If only actual proof were so easy. “Hey, look, someone has the same opinion as me, and they got it published! That makes them, and me, right!” Nice try, Daisy. Keep working on finding actual proof to back up your and Mr. Holtz-Eakin’s opinion, and best of luck on taming those clumsy fingers of yours. “understand it”, not “understandit”; “a very”, not “avery”; “Times”, not “Timmes”. And yet you claim to have years of experience in “data work”.
Dazzeetrader11 on April 12 at 2:36 a.m.
Using an old typewriter. Many articles do conclude what I’ve told you.. In the CBO Budget on healthcare (I’m simplifying this for your brain) ….go see it for yourself…interest is completely NOT THERE.,.
And in the methodology for CBO calulations, there are multiple possible protocols such as advisers…..but the CBO is under no obligation to follow anything an advisor or group of advisors might say.
Data work has nothing to do with accurate typing on an old laptop and it’s not germain either. You’re obviously not going to read CBO…as you wouldn’t understand it or admit it even if you did.
The Times opinion article is based on what? Thin air? Nope that and the other 5 I was going to post all are based on facts in CBO and other data culled from Obama’s so-called budget…which continues to change weekly.
I’ve concluded that either you’re too stupid to get the picture, too underpowered to analyse the facts, both or just a dimwit who’s too lazy to go read CBO. Methods are clear. You’re simply not reading the facts even they put forth. You’ll simply continue to write non applicable responses. Sorry kid….you just don’t get it….or won’t get it. Either way, go read…for now though…it’s late here….and there is nothing I can print, write, etc that might clear things up. You’re just too thick in the skull.
You cannot conclude what you write if you actually read the CBO protocols..if you know what a protocol is….and be this stupid.
spokelooneh on April 12 at 1:37 p.m.
“Daisy Minken on April 12 at 1:43 a.m.
I decided to give you a summary of the costs…not from CBO as I doubt you’d understandit…but here’s avery timely article from the seriously left wing New York Timmes..it’s a decent summary.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/21/opi…”
No, it’s a hit piece by John McCain’s former economic advisor, who’s busily out hocking his opinions to whoever will publish them.
“The New York Times today commits a double failure to disclose in running an op-ed piece by the economist Douglas Holtz-Eakin, who claims that the health-care bill now moving toward final resolution would add $562 billion to the federal deficit.
First, the Times does not note that Holtz-Eakin was a close adviser to John McCain’s presidential campaign, and provided one of the few laugh lines of that dreadful effort by crediting McCain with the development of the BlackBerry.
Second, the Times identifies Holtz-Eakin as the president of the American Action Forum without noting that it is a partisan Republican organization founded by former senator Norm Coleman.
As for the merits of Holtz-Eakin’s argument, he repeats the familiar Republican talking point that the bill’s authors cynically claim savings by counting 10 years’ worth of revenues to pay for six years’ worth of benefits. The non-partisan site PolitiFact.com has pronounced that claim to be “half true.” Keep that in mind as you sift through his bill of particulars.”
http://www.dankennedy.net/tag/douglas-holtz-eakin/
Holtz-Eakin was playing more fairly, back when he had the CBO’s Director job, but got pushed out fairly quickly after his analysis showed that tax cuts NEVER pay for them selves.
“For years, Republicans had been pushing the budget office to change the way it estimated the cost of a tax cut. Rather than looking only at the revenue lost, they argued, the office should also consider how tax cuts would change behavior. With lower tax rates, businesses would invest more, workers would work more — and the government would thus get a tax windfall. This, in a nutshell, is supply-side economics.
…
What the budget office (CBO) found, as study after study has shown, was that any new revenue that tax cuts brought in paled in comparison with their cost. This is why the deficit jumped under the last two tax-cutting presidents (Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush) and fell under the last two tax-raising presidents (George H. W. Bush and Bill Clinton).
…”
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/23/business/23leonhardt.html?ref=todayspaper
misjustice on April 12 at 7:58 p.m.
spookelooneh, Thank you!
edmitch on April 12 at 8:26 p.m.
According to the LA Times
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-health-premiums13-2010apr13,0,6096091.story
Another surprise in the health reform bill:
“with some major companies already moving to boost premiums and others poised to follow suit, millions of Americans may feel an unexpected jolt in the pocketbook.
Although Democrats promised greater consumer protection, the overhaul does not give the federal government broad regulatory power to prevent increases.”
Lots of hidden surprises still to be revealed.
decturkey on April 13 at 1:41 p.m.
I find it hilarious that everyone is always saying someone is wrong. To name a few. Misjustice Sauce and Daisy. So if everyone is always wrong, then who is right? Cause someone has to be right, right? Guess we’ll never know. Cause I guess every article and statistical analysis ever written must be wrong too because they were written by people who associate/d themselves with a party, therefore they are biased. Can’t possibly believe anything they say. So it looks like we’re stuck in a back and forth war. Sounds like the McCain Obama debates all over again hahahaha. Too funny.
chump on April 13 at 3:33 p.m.
This article is insane!
The presumption that people educated in less expensive schools outside of the Republic of Washington state wouldn’t be able to move here and “practice” their medicine? Well that’s preposterous.
I think the short-version of the story is- “Senator Cantwell was bribed (among other things) with the promises of a new medical training facility in Spokane to pacify the victims of further federal armed-gangs robbing them.”
Its crazy that 1. newspapers print the statistics of the very lobbyists as fact, and 2. that some readers would be silly to believe stats coming out of any office within the federal system.
misjustice on April 15 at 11:02 p.m.
edmitch,,,new legislation is being crafted to address the rate hikes that you have mentioned…
I still applaud the effort to bring a new medical campus to our area; it will be a great compliment to the other fine Colleges that our area already hosts.