July 28, 2010 in City

Furor over fluoride hard to swallow

Shawn Vestal The Spokesman-Review

Ten years ago, a push to put fluoride in our water failed, barely, at the polls.

The forces of fluoridation vowed to keep up the fight.

Unfortunately, it’s the forces against fluoride who have kept fighting. And they’re winning, big time, using the same tools that flat-earthers drag out to deny global warming or argue for intelligent design: information that looks suspiciously like science.

The Sandpoint City Council heard a lot of that sciencelike information last week, before it voted to stop fluoridating its water. People argued that fluoride causes health problems, hurts children, makes the sky fall. A lot of these arguments are a click away on the Internet, but I’m not carrying that particular water here.

The world’s health organizations and most scientists line up squarely behind fluoridation. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. The surgeon general. The World Health Organization. The American Dental Association. The American Academy of Pediatrics. The state of Washington’s Health Department. On and on.

A number of surveys of scientific literature arrive at the same conclusion as this one, from the European Archives of Paediatric Dentistry, which analyzed 59 studies done worldwide between 2000 and 2008: “The results of the three reviews showed that water fluoridation is effective at reducing caries (cavities) in children and adults. With the exception of dental fluorosis, no association between adverse effects and water fluoridation has been established.”

Fluorosis causes white spots and streaks on teeth or, in rare and extreme cases, staining; it’s caused when young children ingest too much fluoride overall during key stages of tooth development. The CDC says the vast majority of cases are mild and occur in communities without fluoridated water, as well.

Of course, you’d have to be a dupe to listen to scientists – or the government – about science. What you ought to listen to are billboards. Like the one up right now on East Sprague: “Fluoridation is Public Health Quackery!”

See that? Big and loud. Exclamation points. That’s what works in politics. The small but determined forces against fluoridation in Spokane do not rest. They’re at every Board of Health meeting at the Spokane Regional Health District. And the board, made up of elected officials from the county and cities, is so cowed that its official position on the question is no position, firmed up during the heat of the debate 10 years ago.

Mike Allen, a former city councilman who served on the Health Board, thinks it’s time for another try at water fluoridation in Spokane.

“It makes sense, and the data are empirical,” he said. “The benefits are clearly shown, particularly for children and at-risk populations. … I believe we need to have a conversation about it where the science is expounded and not the voodoo science.”

Nearly three-quarters of Americans drink fluoridated water. Studies estimate that every dollar spent on water fluoridation saves $38 in dental costs later. Survey after survey shows that fluoridated water reduces dental decay in kids. Cheney and Pullman fluoridate their water, as does Fairchild Air Force Base.

“It’s in our air,” said Dr. Janine Johnson, a local dentist and supporter of fluoridation. “It’s in our water. It’s in the food we eat. It’s in hot dogs. It’s in chicken nuggets. Fluoride is just a mineral.”

Johnson faults the local media for failing to report on the matter clearly – for allowing controversy to obscure the science. That’s not my view of the coverage, but it’s doubtlessly true that in the worlds of politics and media, noise often cancels thoughtfulness.

But there is another problem at work here. The pro-fluoride fight ended. I can understand the desire not to throw yourself into a losing battle, but is this a losing battle?

Spokane voters have rejected fluoride three times. Each vote – in 1969, 1984 and 2000 – inched closer to passage. In 2000, Proposition 1 failed by 2 percentage points.

Dr. Kim Thorburn, who was fired four years ago as the county’s health officer after clashing with the board, notes that a lot of health professionals are working to improve dental health – including Johnson and the Oral Health Coalition, a district-led endeavor. But she said the Health Board’s neutrality is an albatross around the neck of any effort to take this to the voters again.

“If you can’t say, ‘Your public health agency strongly endorses this,’ it makes it hard,” she said. “I wish that Spokane would get over the hump.”

In the meantime, dental health here suffers. In the five years after the vote failed, the incidence of dental decay in the county’s young children went from 49 percent to 62 percent, state figures show.

I tried to call the woman who posted the billboard, Rose Marie Waldram. She’s a steady voice of opposition to water fluoridation, and she says she has an allergy to fluoride.

She didn’t return my calls. But her billboard is out there, shouting every day at the drivers passing by on East Sprague.

Somebody ought to talk back.

Shawn Vestal can be reached at (509) 459-5431 or shawnv@spokesman.com.

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55 comments on this story so far. Add yours!

SugarShane on July 28 at 12:14 a.m.
Who cares?
There is more than enough information out there about cannabis, its medically legal in 14 states and the federal government hands it out to a handful of people and yet it remains a schedule I drug classification which is in direct conflict.
People dont care about science, they care about what people tell them, right or wrong. Its called blind faith for a reason.
America and Americans have always played this game of politics with our lives, get over it, crybaby, the voters have spoken.
fluoridefreenz on July 28 at 1:20 a.m.
If you find it hard to understand why people object to fluoridation then you obviously have no idea about respect for other people. It is really very simple - most people do not want someone spiking their drink or telling them they have to take a medication because someone else thinks it’s good. You cannot walk into someone’s house and put a fluoride tablet in the drink without their permission so why on earth would it be alright to do it through the public water supply? We all pay for the water. If you want fluoride, then go eat some toothpaste, but stop trying to force your beliefs onto other people.
Ron_the_Cop on July 28 at 1:27 a.m.
Have you ever noticed that there is a dentist’s office and mattress store on every corner in this town? Do you suppose there is a connection?
nyscof on July 28 at 5:12 a.m.
If this writer didn’t just graduate from high school, there’s really no excuse for his ignorance of modern science surrounding fluoridation which began with the belief that ingested fluoride incorporated into teeth to make them resist teeth. Science disproved that theory. Fluoride hardens outer enamel by topical means and with highly concentrated fluoride via toothpaste and dental treatments. (careful, don’t swallow; it’s a poison)
The Centers for Disease Control reports that the fluoride that emerges from saliva after drinking fluoridated water is too low to have any beneficial effects. However, ingesting fluoride does lead to adverse effects. Google Fluoride Action Network (Shawn - if you want to report accurately, you have to read both sides of an issue. Your side is based on clever PR, appeal to authority; but no science)
Fluoride is neither a nutrient nor essential for healthy teeth. That means consuming a fluoride-free diet does NOT cause tooth decay. Fluoride is in everything - that doesn’t make it good for you.
In fact, research presented at the International Association of Dental Research this year shows that consuming several cups of tea, which is naturally fluoridated, can deliver bone-damaging levels of fluoride.
Proponents and opponents agree that too much fluoride is bad and can cause bone as well as tooth damage. Dosing people with anything via the water supply is foolish.
Tooth decay crises are occurring in all fluoridated cities, states, and countries See: FluorideNews (dot) blogspot
There’s no evidence that any American is, or ever was, fluoride deficient. However, many are dentist-deficient.
80% of dentists refuse Medicaid patients. 130 million Americans don’t have dental insurance. And organized dentistry lobbies against any viable group willing and able to fix teeth - such as dental therapists.
The American Dental Association is a a very politically powerful union that protects the best interests of dentists and they do all they can to assure that dentists retain their lucrative monopoly.
Fluoridation gives the illusion that organized dentistry cares about the low income people who aren’t welcomed in their dental chairs. Some reporters fall for it.
oneanddone on July 28 at 5:16 a.m.
Good ole Shawn. As with other articles written by this person they immediately alienate the majority of America with their own liberal bias claptrap. Is fluoride worth it? Who knows. My kids grew up on well water and all still have had no fillings. Go figure. My bigger issue is to read right off that Shawn thinks anyone who doesn’t accept his viewpoint, and therefore believes in God, belongs in the same category as those who think the earth is flat. Shawn, since you think God is a myth, tell me where the “big bang” originally came from? The Inland NW does not subscribe to the liberal agenda promoted by the SR, and its writers. It’s little wonder why newspapers are in their death throes.
JimSchultz2 on July 28 at 6:03 a.m.
The ADA dental trade organization has but one main goal and all others are last place. Increasing dentist incomes is what they do best and fluoridation is a fantastic tool. Very very few dentists actually treat poor kids on medicaid and fluoridation is the smokescreen to hide that ugly fact. In my county only 4 of over 200 dentists treat the medicaid kids who by far have the greatest needs for a good dentist. We have one public health dentist after many years with none and 45.000 of 49,000 poor kids are underserved. Most getting no dental care in this ignored disaster. The former health department dentist was treating 6 kids a day with a staff of 4 but did not treat a single kid during the office remodel which took 1 and one half years. The next they pay 45 dollars a kid treated so he treats 30 a day with one more staff to schedule kids getting 95,000 thousand. Do the math and figure unless private dentists treat kids never see a dentist .
To make things worse 80% of the problems happen to 20% of the kids. Mostly the poor with no dentist or who end up in the emergency room to pull rotted teeth. Expensive disaster for all.
Detroit 2007 Burt DDS in study showed almost 100% of the kids had cavities by age 5 and still had untreated cavity disaters at age 14 83 % of the time. There are dental disasters happening in almost every poor inner city and 12% more then a decade ago. Burt admitted decades of fluoridation has not made this better as the issue is poor nutrition and few dentists who actually treat the poor. KIds have f water, soda and chips with no vegetables or fruit to create a health disaster. We need dentists to actually treat poor kids not just talk the talk of caring and fluoridation for the needy. They need a caring dentist and good diet. Education is critical also as many dental disasters especially in the poor are parent caused with nap bottles or sippy cups with milk and sugar drinks.This destroys teeth with all top teeth rotted nubs often. Increased ingested fluoride makes no difference show the peer reviewed data. The ADA knows all this data but prefers fluoridation as the smoke to hide soaring dental incomes from treating all the cosmetic damage caused by ingested fluoride toxicity. To bad the poor minorities damaged double ugly usually can not afford the super expensive repairs.
Dentists used to make much less income then doctors but their incomes have stagnated with dentists making far more now working sometimes half the hours. Fluoridation helps make all this possible but has no meaningful cavity decrease. The ADA does strong arm any dentists not willing to promote fluoridation about the same as Jimmy Hoffa Teamsters busted scab labor heads. But then this is about referals and income not baseball bats.
Dentists also have another huge issue of risk and liability in Mercury fillings called silver fillings. Most do not install them as dentists are at huge mercury toxicity risk from the constant exposure. Same for all staff and many dental offices are toxic wastelands releasing almost 100% of the mercury found in the sewage sludge at the city water treatment. Osha has not seen fit to enforce the laws in dental offices. Simple 1000 dollar mercury seperators can cheaply remove end this problem in sewer water. San Francisco is one of the few cities that got every dental office to do that. Complete success and cheap. Lawsuits will happen against dentists on the mercury and fluoride toxicty they cause and promote. In court they say they have no liability as they just give advise and actually do no treatment. The ADA is a huge political force. They usually win using mindless reporter shills too lazy to do their job and get the facts right.
mikeln on July 28 at 6:38 a.m.
It’s the sugar, plain and simple, that is responsible for cavities. Putting flouride in the water is not a liberal thing, it’s rich corporations getting rid of a deadly poison, and making us pay for it.
PlanB on July 28 at 7:03 a.m.
Another point being missed besides the inaccurate and incomplete “science” this article presents: Putting fluoride in the water takes away your choice. People are free to take fluoride tablets if they so choose right now, and without passing the burden of the associated costs to the public.
Gato on July 28 at 7:33 a.m.
To the person who cited the Centers for Disease Control, you may be interested to know that the CDC not only supports fluoridation, but calls it one of the 10 greatest public health achievements of the 20th century. http://www.cdc.gov/fluoridation/
If I have to choose who to believe here, I’m going with the CDC and the World Health Organization, and our state health department instead of someone on Blogspot.
And sure a good parent could get fluoride tablets. My father did, and I have very few cavities. But most parents aren’t that diligent, or don’t have the money, or don’t think about it, or believe that fluoridation is a Russian plot. Why should we make their children suffer by denying them protection?
fishinjay on July 28 at 7:43 a.m.
Plan B nailed it.
Even if flouride is good for dental health (and I am inclined to agree with the science that says it is), spending tax dollars to force it on the populace is not the answer. If you want to be a toothless idiot that doesn’t take care of their health, that’s your choice. I’ll continue to brush my teeth with flouride toothpaste and go on with my life without the need for government to make sure I have a pretty smile.
Stop turning to government to solve every one of your penny-ante concerns!
Gato on July 28 at 8:23 a.m.
Drill, Baby, Drill!
spokanesausage on July 28 at 8:48 a.m.
It’s nice to see that Google Alerts is working for the anti floridation crowd. Do you guys just cut and paste that stuff?
Anyway, I’m not for big government by any means, but in this case the public good, especially for children, seems worth it.
And from the business perspective, dentists have no incentive to promote floridation. The credible science of the benefits of floridation would actually hurt their business.
Funny line Gato.
NyTiVe on July 28 at 9:50 a.m.
No one sums it up better than Councilman Keith Beier of Escondido.
“Our water department calculates that we would be buying more than 33 tons/year of a substance that can’t be given to us for free because it is classified as a toxic hazardous waste; yet, we are supposed to accept that, if we pay $0.35/gallon and they slap a new label on the container, this same toxic waste can be shipped to us untreated, directly from the scrubber systems of the phosphate fertilizer industry that they use to keep fluorine from becoming airborne and killing everything in sight, and that on the truck-ride here it will magically be converted to a safe and desirable nutrient. The kicker to this scheme is that the amount intended for the targeted children is only 16 pounds of that 33 tons.”
RandySpokaneNewspaper on July 28 at 9:53 a.m.
It has been my pleasure to return to the good side of the mountains, after 20 years in Puget Sound; way too liberal politics over there… But alas, do I find wacko’s in Spokane, too? Or, maybe it’s just that I’m reading the Opinion page when I read this article on fluoride. I’m wondering if it would be possible for the author to be any more blatant about his bias.
(I suppose it’s always better to know who your enemies are.)
Whether or not I agree with the science, I have no desire whatsoever to read his opinion…. and I’m sure as heck not going to pay to do so. And now I can remove “Subscribe to local newspaper” from my To-Do list.
JBlim on July 28 at 9:55 a.m.
The fluoridation conspiracy exposed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4XhhTF7vRM
MrNatural on July 28 at 9:58 a.m.
Shawn, don’t bother to argue with the fluoride zealots. As mentioned above there is a combination of reasons why the tin foil hat, torch and pitchfork, my life my choice, facts aside, superstitious, government conspiracy, corporations kill crowd detest fluoride. I often wonder how long it will take for it to dawn on this same crowd to protest against chlorination which is a much more dangerous compound. Why proponents don’t counter fluoride opponents anymore is due to the utter exasperation of arguing with whack-jobs who prefer their knowledge from cut and paste Brujo resources. Fear, ignorance, and suspicion are a powerful brainwash intoxicant. I must say Shawn you really poked the hornets’ nest on this one…you devil.
As you mentioned fluoride is in many foods and products and in many places occurs naturally in groundwater. There are places where the natural level of fluoride is elevated to the point where water purveyors need to reduce the amount due to the aesthetics of discoloring teeth.
And as mentioned above those of us who believe in what the intelligent respectable scientific / medical professional organizations represent on the benefits of fluoride will use alternatives methods and be confident about it.
Having grown up with the millions of people on the east coast who benefit from fluoridated water I am quite confident it is safe and effective.
Shawn Just consider the source and keep in mind this memorable quote from Dr. Strangelove
“Mandrake!…we must protect our precious bodily fluids or the communists win!”…Gen. Jack D. Ripper.
SarahF on July 28 at 10:05 a.m.
All I know is that when I was a child, drinking fluoridated tap water from my city water supply, I didn’t have a single cavity. When I went to a place where the water tasted horrid and started drinking bottled water, I had four in three years. Considering how much I had to pay for those fillings, I’d really like to avoid them.
I’ll keep my fluoridated water, thank you. And a fluoride mouthwash, and fluoride toothpaste. :)
zelda on July 28 at 10:30 a.m.
This is a city full of wing nuts and getting worse every year. The only valid definition of poison is “too much.” But most folks around here can’t figure out what parts per million means much less dillution or compound interest on a payday loan.
Just like vaccinations, people in this area care only about themselves and will do nothing for the common good of their fellow citizens.
And why don’t people object to chlorine? It’s added to the drinking supply of many municipalities to kill bacteria. Why pick only on fluoride? What about all the naturally occurring trace minerals — selenium, magenese, iron, copper, etc.?
If you think your body is a temple, quit eating Hot Pockets and dining at Taco Bell.
fishinjay on July 28 at 10:37 a.m.
Simply put: stop trying to remove choice through government intervention. A person who doesn’t want flouride (adult or child) is not affecting you or your family one tiny bit, so what gives you the right to remove their ability to make a choice on such a simple matter?
Unfortunately the flouride nuts make it difficult to talk about this issue rationally. I think most reasonable, intelligent people who look at the science agree that a small amount of flouride is good for you.
The issue for most who aren’t wingnuts is choice. Just because it can be beneficial does not mean we need to spend our tax dollars on it, especially when there are many who would choose not to use flouride. I buy flouride toothpaste because I choose to use flouride for my dental hygiene. I don’t believe that government intervention should preclude my individual choices. If you don’t want to use flouride, then you shouldn’t be forced into it.
The argument that it’s “for the children” is bogus too, and is used in any case where we want to increase government intervention in our private lives, but can’t come up with a strong argument.
If you’re a “do it for the children” nut then how about we start mandating birth control pills for all children? After all the pills have been scientifically proven safe for younger women, and the difficulties of being a single, under 18 parent are pretty widely known. Shouldn’t we protect these children from teen pregnancy?
Or maybe we stop allowing people to choose not to have their kids immunized? Science has shown immunizations to be safe, but we don’t arrest parents who choose otherwise or force their children into being immunized while they are away at school. Shouldn’t we protect children from disease?
The examples could go on and on…..
JBlim on July 28 at 10:42 a.m.
fishinjay never heard of bottled water
idahocity on July 28 at 10:45 a.m.
the bottom line is americans talk a good game but when it comes down to it we hate personal freedom and love love our drugs… except marijuana.
fishinjay on July 28 at 11:00 a.m.
I’ve heard of bottled water wingnut. Have you heard of flouride toothpaste?
The difference between the two is that one is produced with tax dollars and the other is not. Adding flouride to toothpaste allows you to retain your choice as an individual. Adding flouride to water removes individual choice as a taxpayer.
You can choose not to buy toothpaste with flouride and lose nothing. There are plenty of similarly priced options without it.
If the city puts flouride in the drinking water and you don’t want flouride, not only are your tax dollars going toward a public water supply that you won’t drink, you are also forced to spend extra money to secure a non-flouridated drinking water supply.
Flouride is so easily obtained in so many other ways. Why do people feel the need to cram it down the throats of others who don’t want it?
mikewsu on July 28 at 11:10 a.m.
Hate to break it to you, RandySpokaneNewspaper: but mission accomplished! You just earned the Spokesman valuable ad dollars and even created an account sharing your personally identifiable information.
Now stop complaining, child.
Why attack the writer? Shouldn’t you be directing your frustration/hissy fits at maybe: Mike Allen, Dr Thornburg or Dr. Janine Johnson. (Those who oppose your views instead of those who report the information.)
TommyBoy on July 28 at 11:40 a.m.
It is sad to see what happens in a community where the average IQ is so low. Science be damned. Junk-Science rules the world in our area!!!!!!!!
As to why dentists don’t take medicaid….could it be that the reimbursement rate is only $0.31 per every dollar.??? And that makes running the business almost impossible with payments that low…????
Nawwww…it’s just a bunch of greedy dentists who only care about padding their wallets.
You get what you deserve Spokane…high cavity rates, pain and suffering for the young people…and the honors of being the low IQ capital of the Pacific NW… Bravo…. Now go drink another Arizona Iced Tea.
JBlim on July 28 at 11:50 a.m.
fishinjay: You have the choice to go to private free, enterprise bottled water. Where do you get free taxpayer water anyway? I have to pay my water bill every month. Then I have to pay for fluoride treatments. By the way what kind of toothpaste do you use, assuming you still have teeth? Some of that fluoride free stuff?
maddiewalker on July 28 at 11:56 a.m.
This is the most biased, poorly written article I have ever come across. I am astounded at the poor quality of this article—it sounds like something I might read in a Jr.High newpaper.
This person needs to go back to college. What journalism program did this guy come from?
maddiewalker on July 28 at 12:00 p.m.
hey Tommy boy—the Nazi’s flouridated their water to make sheeple stupid—that’s the last thing this city needs. You want flouridated water, then crush up a flouride pill and add it to YOUR water—just keep it out of mine!
maddiewalker on July 28 at 12:02 p.m.
and “oneanddone”—this guy is no liberal—he sounds like a righty to me.
maddiewalker on July 28 at 12:05 p.m.
And Zelda Crup—I do object to chlorine. We use chlorine in this country because it’s the cheapest method. It’s certainly not the safest, though.
Vericon on July 28 at 12:50 p.m.
Well, if other contaminants including trace amounts of pharmaceutical drugs like birth control pills, anti-depressants and chemo aren’t enough, the city with Shawns efforts wants to add flouride. Why can’t we just have pure, clean water? But I digress.
Aside from all the pro and con arguments, I really just want to point out that Shawn’s artticle was sheer editorial opinion and as such belonged on the editorial page….not the front page as NEWS. We’re all entitled to our opinion, but it shouldn’t be doctored up as fact. It is clear that with this “article” and the recent one’s involving Mexican illegals in our area, the Spokesman-Review has become (and perhaps always was) a yellow rag.
zelda on July 28 at 12:55 p.m.
Well, we’ve plummeted to the Nazi phase of the argument, so no further rational discussion is possible. What Spokane needs in its drinking water is saltpeter and lithium.
flutieflakes on July 28 at 1:04 p.m.
Barack Hussein Obama is sneaking fluoride into your drinking water! To sterilize your testicles!
MY TEETH MY CHOICE! Palin ‘12 ;)
zelda on July 28 at 1:20 p.m.
“saltpeter and lithium” — I was exaggerating for effect; not advocating for these chemicals.
But I have to wonder if the fluoride controversy has its roots in the old myth about enemy forces putting saltpeter in drinking water to suppress men’s sexual potency. Yup, our “precious bodily fluids” are in danger a la “Dr. Strangelove.”
TommyBoy on July 28 at 1:25 p.m.
Wow, the insanity here is unbelievable. Do any, any, of you people posting here place any value in Science…The Scientific Method….or modern treatments to ailments….. That’s what I thought..
You people are no better than mindless peons wanting to ward off evil spirits with lavender and spice… Get back to your Bongs. Wow, just wow.
MrNatural on July 28 at 2:28 p.m.
Zelda…LOL!…right off my chair!…
I really think you have something there about the saltpeter and lithium…but then I begin to wonder if terrorist might be putting Spanish fly and meth in the aquifer right now…doo doo doo doo
JBlim on July 28 at 2:55 p.m.
Duh, fluoridation is a Communist conspiracy started in 1946. . .
mickieyezekroller on July 28 at 5:11 p.m.
I was 52 years old and I had a massive stroke in 1999. I’m 62. I couldn’t speak, completely aphasic, and I couldn’t walk; confined to a wheelchair and five hospitals. Nothing clicks. It’s a profound, hopelessly, bleak situation and no way out. It’s tabula rasa; it’s a blank slate.
I’m not a physician, or a dentist, or a science guy. That said, here’s my events about the stroke and mercury fillings. I obtained medical records 10 years ago. I suffered from funky foul breath and a metallic taste; paralyzing fear all the time, constantly; excessive sweating, and palpitations so heart-stopping, so violent and nasty, for 20 years. I know what I know.
Read my blog. 20 pages.
http://mercuryfillingsandtheoddstroke.blogspot.com/
and How to Stroke Out with Mercury Fillings (FireHow.com) It’s an amended version. Three pages.
Thank you.
Spokane_Citizen on July 28 at 5:27 p.m.
Idahoans don’t need toothies anyway, just tattoos, camo, mudflaps, and plenty of relatively fresh roadkill. Hell, you can get chrome dentures to match yer harley!
Remember, this is the bunch that waited hours in the rain to see Sarah Palin. And they can’t ‘refudiate’ that.
Few people know that the toothbrush was invented in Idaho….if invented anywhere else it would now be known as a ‘teethbrush’.
Spokane_Citizen on July 28 at 5:33 p.m.
While yer at it, you might as well prohibit chlorinating yer public water supply. That way you can enjoy freedom, as well as epidemic diarrhea! Nobody has the right to tell you what yer gonna drink with yer water…..stand up and be proud (between epic bouts on the toilet).
The Panhandle’s tourist motto could be: “Come for the mountains, stay for the black death”.
Fluorosis on July 28 at 6:32 p.m.
I come from New Zealand where we are now have around 50% of our population drinking fluoridated water. My family is now in the third generation of drinking fluoridated water… We are the walking proof that this giant human experiment is neither safe are effective. All of us have bio markers of fluoride poisoning. Our bones and our teeth are weak and despite this being heralded as a method to prevent decay we all also have decay. Our Ministry of Health has conducted it’s own studies which clearly and consistently show that 30% of children in fluoridated areas are suffering from varying degrees of dental fluorosis as opposed to 15% in non fluoridated areas. These studies do not take into account that people have relocated out of fluoridated areas into non fluoridated areas. They also do not take into account how much fluoride is sneaking into the food we eat everyday if it is made in fluoridated areas. The last two studies show NO difference in dental decay between fluoridated and non fluoridated areas. One in three women over 50 have some form of arthritis, bone pain or osteoperosis. I spend a lot of time in the community and am shocked at how many people are walking around with signs of poisoning in the form of dental fluorosis. Saying that it is merely cosmetic or rare is laughable. Would you say that the thin blue line on the top gum which indicates you have lead poisoning is merely cosmetic? Fluorosis shows that someone has had way too much fluoride. It’s accumulative so we are storing in our bones 50% of what we ingest. Would you be happy if this were lead or arsenic in your bones? Who monitors the people who are sensitive to the poison? who monitored my children when their teeth were forming and now have teeth awaiting a $10 000 cosmetic bill each! No one… Shawn, you pointing the finger at people who are anti fluoride as flat earthers I find to be offensive. Take a walk in my shoes. I have kids who are teased because their teeth are so horrible… I have had no say in having to be medicine my whole life, that I was never told could harm me, that I never consented to. It’s unethical, it’s outdated. The science is there, the proof is there on the faces and bodies of the longterm users. Soon there will be no fluroridation and people like you having written un researched articles like this will be very red faced indeed.
oneanddone on July 28 at 6:44 p.m.
This issue certainly kicked the internet whacko ant hill. The billboard says it all when it compares fluoridation to the use of penicillin. Some are certainly allergic to the antibiotic but the vast majority are not. And penicillin has save millions of lives. Probably a number of people reading this wouldn’t be here because their ancestor would have died without it. Comparing fluoride to penicillin is a specious argument. Whether you like it or not, both have helped us live better lives.
misjustice on July 28 at 6:55 p.m.
Leave it to the subject of water fluoridation to lead to a thread this long; why, it’s a longer thread than the I hate the gubmint tellin’ me to wear a life vest while floating the river…all I can say is, WOW!
Q: How do you compliment a person that lives where the water isn’t fluoridated?
A: Nice tooth! ; )
RickS on July 28 at 10:36 p.m.
Seems that basing a column upon name-calling ought to be below those entrusted with such choice real estate as Mr. Vestal was provided for this disappointing piece. Sad.
nyscof on July 29 at 2:39 a.m.
Fluoridation chemicals (silicofluorides) are derived from the smokestacks of phosphate fertilizer industry and are allowed to contain many toxins that are never removed.

NSF International is a private company that regulates public water supply additives. February 2008 NSF reported they tested only 245 batches of fluoridation chemicals from 2000 to 2006 which received their “seal of approval” (There are approximately 155,000 US public water supplies and 70% are fluoridated.) They found lead in 2% of the samples and 43% had arsenic. Lead and arsenic are contaminants allowed in fluoridation chemicals, as they are poured into your drinking water supply, along with antimony, arsenic, barium, beryllium, cadmium, chromium, copper, mercury, selenium, and thallium. See:
http://www.nsf.org/business/water_distribution/pdf/NSF_Fact_Sheet.pdf
Spokane_Citizen on July 29 at 6:36 a.m.
There’s nothing more idiotic than attaching a link to a site (such as NSF’s) that doesn’t support your assertion. Apparently you never fully read (or understand) the material, or you figure most people won’t look at the link, or if they do, will follow your practice of either not comprehending its information or getting overwhelmed with scientific jargon.
Furthermore, NSF doesn’t regulate water supplies. It is a certification body that develops standards that some governments may decide to adopt. Private companies don’t have regulatory powers (thankfully, though I suspect some of the major loons from this thread would blindly believe a private company more than the government).
Thayne on July 29 at 8:01 a.m.
The same idiots decrying fluoride in the water are the ones saying vaccinations for kids cause downs syndrome - even though at least three independent studies have show otherwise. Now deadly diseases such as whooping cough, measles and scarlet fever are coming back because brain washed parents aren’t getting their kids the required and necessary shots. If less than one percent of a population is sensitive or allergic to fluoride in the water does it make sense to discontinue something that thousands of doctors, scientists and researchers say is a health benefit for the majority of people? Unfortunately the chicken little’s of the world are given to much “air time”. Hopefully rationally thinking people will realize not everything is a conspiracy.
MrNatural on July 29 at 9:17 a.m.
There is a toxic soup roaming your neighborhoods unabated right now and it has affected your children exposing them to poisonous substances so foul as to render them aged over time. It is filled with the persistent bioaccumulative toxins such as PCB’s and harbors heavy metals, ammonia, aldehydes and ketones just to name a few. This danger has been known to spread fatal diseases, incite lethal reactions, and create conditions so unsafe that it is often known to kill at high speed without warning. It has been accumulating in hazardous waste sites located in our residential neighborhoods…these sites are deceptively called cemeteries…yes this terminal horror is called the vile homo-sapien and something must be done to control it…we should use fluoride…
idahocity on July 29 at 9:20 a.m.
“First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win.”
according to gandi, we’re half way there.
eagleproducer on July 29 at 10:05 a.m.
Dental issues are the number one reason for absenteeism in elementary schools. I don’t support putting fluoride into the water system but there needs to be some type of support for low income people seeking dental treatment other than waiting for their teeth to rot and then having them yanked at a public clinic.
Fixing a single molar that requires root canal, without insurance, costs well over two thousand dollars. Try finding a dentist office open on a Friday.
MrNatural on July 29 at 11:22 a.m.
Yeah…”Gandhi”…Now there was a great set of teeth!…
Verbal on July 29 at 11:54 a.m.
Can’t think of where I heard this, but thought it pretty much fits this topic for our area:
“Never underestimate the power of ignorance and apathy. If the ignorant show up and the reasonable are apathetic…ignorance wins.”
Fluoridate the water.
SugarShane on July 29 at 10:19 p.m.
Thayne said “The same idiots decrying fluoride in the water are the ones saying vaccinations for kids cause downs syndrome”.
Talk about your idiots, down syndrome is caused by and extra gene on the 21st chromosome, a genetic defect, Autism which I think you were trying to mention has no known cause established but is possibly linked to genetics and environmental factors.
JimSchultz2 on July 31 at 7:14 p.m.
The FSA is H2SiF6 straight from pollution scrubbers smokestacks of phosphate plants most in Florida. Many other contaminates also are captured and recycled water from toxic dump pits for all toxins is the source of this water often. Many of the solids do settle out thankfully. It is a crapshoot what is going to be in your batch. Only a small hand full are tested in any given year. It is blind faith more or less. The mines also produced up to 75% of all uranium for the US but the last recovery unit closed 1990 in Lake Wales but there had been 7 in Florida. Most operated as black ops to keep a low profile as no one wants to live next to a uranium mine. The FSA does also of course contain radioactive decay products not mentioned to dentists or public.
The bigger toxin issue is the actual fluoride but the FSA is fantastic at corrosion and leaching lead from brass or solder. Masters and Coplan in 1999 proved 41% more lead in blood of kids with FSA fluoridation.
2007 Maas and Coplan 2007 showed details how FSA leached lead and became more efficient at that with chlorine or many times worse with Chloramine. Washington Dc had a lead disaster for over 3 years starting on Nov 1 2000. That was the date they switched to chloramine. Lead levels shot up from leaching to hundreds and thousands of times over the allowed max. They refused to tell the public for almost three full years.

This was front page for 30 days in 2003 Washington Post. Warnings for 25,000 homes and free filters and bottled water. They blamed old lead pipes but the levels were just in high in another 100,000 homes with no lead pipes. They fired the Corrosion expert Mark Edwards PHD from Virginia Tech as he would not aid in a cover up. He stated the extra corrosion caused maybe tens of billions of damage to pipes and homes from leaks,water damage and replacement of pipes nationally.
There is no doubt FSA fluoridation causes more corrosion and lead leaching into our water. Orthophosphate can be used to reduce corrosion and leaching but PH is very important also. There are so many variables that constantly change and every water and process is different.
Only a fool would believe fluoride a nutrient with no negative effects. Or maybe a dentist trained to repeat that talking point. If they would treat some poor kids they would see the damage fluoridation causes. Poor nutrition , poor habits and few dental visitis are what cause most dental disasters. Ingested fluorides are no cure. We all deserve informed consent of all risks. That does not exist with fluoridation. Lawsuits will happen maybe against dentists first who give extra supplements to already fluoridated toxic kids. Many do especially to poor blacks. Even Time magazine warned in april this year fluoridation is a neurotoxin and mutigenic when ingested. It was number 4 of the top ten toxins in your home. Drink up true believers at your own risk. Your dentist is not a toxicologist. When tested most dentists fail fluoride science. Yoder K.M. 2007 see the test results on pubmed.com . Shocking ignorance proven by dentists. This was for Indiana and illinois dental professionals.
poisontap on September 05 at 4:32 p.m.
Fluoride is a *topical* agent that kills germs on contact and it was never meant to be ingested. It’s basically similar to swallowing Neosporin.
It’s very easy for everyone to dismiss anti-fluoridation as the movement of crackpots. To all of you I say this: You are asking the wrong question. The question is not whether or not water fluoridation is good for you. The question is why any municipality would medicate the water supply without your consent. Why not dump multivitamins into the water? Vitamins are also good for you right? The answer is obvious. Just because you may get all of your
vitamins from one source doesn’t mean your neighbor does. Wise up people. We personally don’t really care about the ‘why’. We just want it stopped! Join us in the growing movement.
Steve
www.PoisonTap.org
poisontap on September 05 at 5:01 p.m.
“misjustice on July 28 at 6:55 p.m.
Leave it to the subject of water fluoridation to lead to a thread this long; why, it’s a longer thread than the I hate the gubmint tellin’ me to wear a life vest while floating the river…all I can say is, WOW!
Q: How do you compliment a person that lives where the water isn’t fluoridated?
A: Nice tooth! ; )”
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Wow. What a wit you have. Judging from the posts here, I can see that nobody owns a passport and thus have visited the rest of the world where a major majority does NOT fluoridate the water. I lived in Scandinavia for 11 years and I NEVER had dental problems until I returned to the states. In fact, 98% of countries in the world have rejected water fluoridation and show no increase in tooth decay. Now, rather than directly address my point I’m guessing that the fluoride fans posting here will respond with insults. I mean really! This is the information age isn’t it?. Google it or get a pen pal for God’s sake!