August 14, 2011 in City

Remedial math routine for local grads at CCS

High rates not new and are national, educators say; subject ‘is hard’

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Click thumbnail to view full-size graphic.

The percentage of students taking remedial math classes at Spokane Community College and Spokane Falls Community College is an eye-popping statistic.

Of the 2009-’10 graduates from Spokane Public Schools who were admitted to the community colleges, 86.8 percent required remedial math after taking placement tests. For Central Valley School District students it was 92.4 percent, and for Mead School District students, 81.1 percent.

But math educators who have researched the remedial rates say math achievement is not a recent issue or one that’s limited to the region. The percentage of students taking remedial math in the Community Colleges of Spokane has been at the current level for at least two decades, and studies show the average remedial rate nationwide for community college students is around 60 percent.

Armed with more data than ever before about math performance, educators are working to lower the remedial rates and improve math requirements and curriculum in K-12 and beyond.

“It’s bad … it’s always been bad,” said Jim Brady, dean of computing, math and science at Spokane Falls Community College, who has studied remedial math rates in depth. “Since the (first) WASL , we’ve shined a light on math. What we forget to do is shine the light back to see if they were ever doing better. They weren’t.”

Bill Moore, policy associate of assessment, teaching and learning with the Washington State Board for Community and Technical Colleges, said, “It’s a long-standing issue, and it’s a complicated issue.”

But he added, “It is certainly by no means a Washington problem. There is a lot of focus on it nationally, and there’s a lot of work being done.”

Math rates have come into the spotlight for a variety of reasons: State assessments, the implementation of placement tests at community colleges and a math requirement for most college degrees are among them, officials say.

“One of the worst coincidences” was the advent of a new math curriculum – integrated math – at the same time the Washington Assessment of Student Learning and the No Child Left Behind Act hit schools, Brady said. “So if you look at it, we really weren’t paying much attention to math until about 2000.”

Because WASL scores were bad, educators began looking at college placement tests, which had been in place for only a few years, “and they were bad,” Brady said. “I think there was a silent assumption that things used to be good until the changes.”

He added, “The whole idea of math requirements for all degrees in college, that’s a relatively new idea. When people went to college in the ’70s and ’80s, they didn’t have to take placement tests. You didn’t have to take a math class to get a bachelor’s degree.”

Brady became curious when the math remedial rates first came to his attention, and began researching how many students were taking remedial classes in the 1990s. “I figured if anything has integrity in our data it’s got to be transcripts. The amount of students coming out of high school who take developmental math has been pretty consistent for nearly 20 years.”

So then Brady wondered what math scores looked like once the student had been in college math for a quarter. “And what we found out was their success wasn’t that much better,” he said. “It’s not a high school problem, it’s not a college problem, what it comes down to is, math is hard.”

People have a tendency to want to blame textbooks, blame the standards or blame a particular approach to teaching math, but “it’s a combination,” Moore said. “It’s helpful to remember that until recently the high school graduation requirement was two years of math. The notion that these students should be college-ready when they graduate is a recent expectation.”

So what’s being done to address the issue?

Both Spokane Public Schools and Central Valley School District have increased the number of math credits a student must take to meet graduation requirements – three credits or three years of math rather than two.

Statewide, the class of 2015 will be required to pass end-of-course exams, or an approved alternative, in algebra and geometry, according to the Office of the Superintendent of Public Instruction.

The placement tests for Community Colleges of Spokane, which had been national tests, were redesigned a year and a half ago to align with courses taught locally, which has already decreased the amount of students taking remedial math, Brady said.

The Carnegie Foundation, an independent policy and research center founded by Congress in 1906, is heading up one of the national efforts on math education.

“New curricular pathways are being developed, such as creating pathways where math would make more sense for their work and their lives,” Moore said of that effort. “Students need to be more actively engaged. We don’t want students in rows, the teacher does a problem and the students do 28 similar problems,” said Moore. “In general, it’s about finding ways to accelerate their success and improve their learning. Also, we are hoping to improve the perception of math.”

Said Moore, “I wish there was a simple answer, but there’s not. It will never be down to zero percent, but it can certainly be better than it is now.”

30 comments on this story so far. Add yours!

• 

  Crusty1 on August 14 at 8:10 a.m.

  More math credits in High School, of the wrong type of instruction, will NOT fix anything for the CCS. Get a clue Spokane schools!

• 

  topck on August 14 at 8:55 a.m.

  Really! Mediocrity is the best we can do? Let’s not even try? This is just the way it is going to be?

  Nationally 60% is the level but we are in the high 80 so we don’t have room for much improvement?

  It’s been this way for twenty years so we can’t improve it?

  I would say that the whole education system is messed up. Our parents and their children are not being served well at all. The whole education system that has been established over the last 30 years needs to be dismantled and refocused on core curriculum like math, science (which requires math) reading, writing (which requires reading), PE, the Constitution, instead of group think, consensus and socialization.

  School Board candidate Sally Fullmer has brought this issue to light as well as high superintendents pay with poor results. Spokane school needs the transparency that she will help create. But she will need more help than the current school board who in my opinion has been covering this up.

  Go Sally Go!

• 

  de3 on August 14 at 9:46 a.m.

  National rate - 60% take remedial math.
  Local rates - 80% to 90+% take remedial math

  And we try to pawn this off as a national problem?

  “The placement tests for Community Colleges of Spokane, which had been national tests, were redesigned a year and a half ago to align with courses taught locally, which has already decreased the amount of students taking remedial math, Brady said.”

  With levels running 80% to 92% now, what on earth did they decrease from? 95%? 100%?

• 

  WillyPeter on August 14 at 9:49 a.m.

  Thank District 81 pooh-bahs for the Constructivism Math that pre-high schoolers now receive. And then the Integrated Math they receive in high school. Followed up by “failing” math scores on pre-college exams.

  Thank our dysfunctional, country club, school board for being enablers of the District’s support of these absurd, regressive “techniques.”

  Thank the union, the Spokane Education Association, for caring for little more than accumulating dollars from hard working District teachers.

  Thank all these folks for continuing to destroy math in our schools. And the competitive futures of our young……

  And if you like all this, make sure you vote for those folks recommended by those discussed above…….

• 

  The_Seer on August 14 at 9:54 a.m.

  topk: When is the last time you were actually in a public school classroom? Ultimately, learning is the responsibility of the learner, not the educator. Every school I’ve worked in offers the type of core curriculum that will prepare a student for higher education. If students (and their parents) decide to ignore/not engage with the learning opportunities offered it is not the fault of the school.

  Even the most basic upper level math of the type required to obtain a non-math major is irrelevant to the student once they finish the course. I have never used algebra once since leaving that classroom. I did not attend college right away after graduating high school (six years active U.S. Navy) and managed to “test out” of having to take any college math because I paid attention and applied myself in high school The problems students encounter in mathematics begin way before they reach high school and their lack of proficiency is exposed by standardized tests.

  I’ve also taught Composition 101 at the college level and the problem is not just with math. Most students still can’t compose a well argued essay or “read closely” with critical insight. I also can’t remember one time I’ve encouraged “group think” but if you think building consensus and socialization are poor ideas go live in a deserted island by yourself.

  How can the school board be “covering this up?” Test results are public record. The public has long known that District 81’s schools are a mess but keep sending the same people back to the school board to provide a “fix.”

  The best and brightest students emerging from public school are the best and brightest students ever. You need to look at the changed demographic in the U.S. over the last 30-40 years. Do the students from this changed demographic come from families that value education because education has served them well?

  I agree that District 81 superintendent Nancy Stowell is highly overpaid and has produced dismal results during her tenure. As you’ll see from this chart, she is not alone. There are many district supers in Washington that make more than the Governor and dozens who make more than their “boss” the State Superintendent of Public Instruction. As teachers we’ve been told these high salaries are so we can attract and retain the talent these highly sought after individuals provide. I’ve called B.S. on that many times and loudly at school board meetings. Have you?

  http://www.salaries.wa.gov/documents/SchoolSuptsvsSPI.pdf

  That document shows the salaries of school district supers throughout Washington state and compare them with state-wide elected officials.

• 

  steptoe_fan on August 14 at 11:07 a.m.

  for the years I taught at the community college level in WA i would have to agree, the majority of ‘parents’ now, are disconnected from understanding the value of an education.

  they send children to school simply to be off loaded. schools should not be having to provide the role of a surrogate parent. individuals who are sent to school hungry, lacking the physical support and unresponsive to discipline, destroy the classroom.

  they should be sent home, immediately.

  schools should not be employing counselors. if children need counseling, send them home to their parents.

  i have witnessed grade inflation, incompetent administrators, the dumping of students in the CC level by HS’s that simply give up and declare victory and diluted curriculum. students that can’t multiply or divide in their head, and can’t make change without the cash register to tell them what to give back.

  fractions or algebra ? you must be joking, right ? !

  i would be terrified to examine a 9th grade math book - for what i would probably find.

  you in Spokane think you have a problem, come on over to King county.

  the ‘all about me’ generation, and our insistence that children with disabilities belong in the main stream complete the destructive process.

  public education is beyond repair. america decline accelerates.

• 

  SugarShane on August 14 at 11:13 a.m.

  Don’t forget colleges are a business. When I was placed in remedial math in Fall 08 from what I was told SFCC had placement scores that were much higher standards than other schools. This created a surplus of people PAYING to take extra classes that don’t even count towards a degree. I was OK at math, but because I was a little under the wire had to do math 91, 92 and 99, plus math 107 as a degree req. They finally lowered the placement score not very long ago, I would have met the req, but they already have my money. Its a scam, and more and more, unless you have an MBA or a Law degree it almost seems like going to college isn’t even worth it.

• 

  misjustice on August 14 at 11:19 a.m.

  When I took algebra and geometry in high school I didn’t “get it”…math just wasn’t my thing. But I was taking, what at the time was termed, college prep classes so those were required courses and failing was NOT an option.

  My parents hired a tutor for me and I worked at it, and worked at it until I was able to grasp the concepts well enough to pass the course work.

  Additionally, my parents were strict; no teevee or playing with our friends until the homework was done. And if I did not make the honor roll, I was grounded until the next semester’s grades came out.

  Parents must partner with the schools to ensure that their children learn, not just drop the kids off at the front door and expect the teachers to do it all. Sadly, many parents just aren’t that invested in their kids education. Is it any wonder, then, that kids aren’t either?

• 

  ZagChuck on August 14 at 12:20 p.m.

  These leftist instructors posting here are part of the problem, not part of the solution.

  They expect us ignorant taxpayers to believe that it’s all the parents and students fault, not the fault of their teaching buddies. Both of them chimed in the same talking point given to them by the WEA. Somehow they believe we’re to stupid to realize they’re saying parents here are somehow less responsible than the national average, otherwise we’d be in the 60% as well….

  Maybe some self reflection is in order for their overpaid pompous selves.

  You can bet these same fools who are failing to instruct our children, and then blaming society for their failuires, will be marching and picketing if they don’t get more money, though.

• 

  ZagChuck on August 14 at 12:22 p.m.

  @ Sugar Shane,

  Only private colleges are a business, the rest of them are simple exchangers of taxpayer money.

• 

  Diana on August 14 at 1:26 p.m.

  Right on cue, ZagChuck.

• 

  Pigrobin on August 14 at 1:45 p.m.

  Hmm, why not prepare college-bound high school students to be able to place into college-level math? I would have to say it’s a true failing on our public school curriculum and math/science teachers if the state of WA cannot do that. If the students fail to engage and fail to place, then they take the remedial courses. That is…if they really want a college education. If they don’t, then so be it. Not everyone should go to college after high school. Either way, the 80-90% remedial rate is excessive. If I were a WA public school math teacher, I would not be too proud of this stat and I would make sure my college-bound students had the tools to pass a placement test. If I couldn’t do that, I think I’d look for a job where I could be more successful.

• 

  sdolan on August 14 at 3:18 p.m.

  Nationally CC’s place students in remedial math at less than 40%. CC of Spokane has worked hard to place 80 plus percent and have shifted the blame on teachers, local districts, students, and parents. Wow, their economics classes must be great at SFCC and SCC because this is simply a dollar issue and they are pulling in a lot of them! They failed to mention that students are not allowed to use a calculator on entry math exam and the material tested on is the curriculum from their freshman year.How is it that a higher percentage of high school students pass the math exam at WSU than SFCC? Are CCS’s standards that high? I think not.

• 

  avocet on August 14 at 3:32 p.m.

  How ironic that this discussion is going on while teachers and students languish in their 3-month summer vacation…….

• 

  The_Seer on August 14 at 4:20 p.m.

  ^^^^

  Languish? I’m hardly languishing while I pay for classes required to keep my certification. I’m pretty sure I wasn’t the one who invented and advocated for a nine month school year. I’d much rather work year round and be paid accordingly. Which means you’d need to increase our salaries by 1/4, which means you’d experience higher property taxes. Are you ready to sacrifice for “the children?”

  sdolan: You really need to have your question comparing WSU and CCS students answered? Students planning to attend WSU must go through an application process the is selective. Students admitted to four year schools are almost automatically higher achievers in high school. Duh….

  Zagchucked: You wouldn’t last a week in a high school classroom. As for overpaid…. bagger, please. We make a fraction of what similarly educated and credentialed professionals earn.

• 

  gmorton on August 14 at 4:51 p.m.

  The_Seer wrote,

  “Ultimately, learning is the responsibility of the learner, not the educator.”

  You’re half right. But that is an important half.

  The real problem, you see, is that the entire education system proceeds from a false premise, namely, that education should be universal.

  While the present State monopoly does serve as a magnet for incompetent teachers, because there is no competition to weed them out, it is also a magnet for incompetent students. Probably half the kids in high school shouldn’t be there at all, and even fewer belong in college.

  But we’ve bought into the egalitarian myth, you see, and so cannot acknowledge that fact. “No Child Left Behind!”

  LOL.

• 

  avocet on August 14 at 5:15 p.m.

  Seer, you sound mighty defensive. Gee, I wonder why?

  WHY do teachers always seem to think that they are the only ones who have to pay to continue their certification? Join the crowd!

  And you may not have “advocated” for a 9-month school year, but you sure as hell enjoy the benefits of it. Disengeunous much? The myth of the underpaid teacher is just that, a MYTH. $70,000 for a 9-month gig is a pretty sweet deal.

  I am surrounded by teachers. While I slog off to work every day this summer, they are hauling their boat to the lake.

  Any connection to the remedial math, English, etc? There are many factors, but the part-time school year is CERTAINLY one of them.

• 

  ZagChuck on August 14 at 5:48 p.m.

  Seer, you’re paid a years salary for 3/4 of years work, and yet you complain while on vacation.

• 

  reservedparking on August 14 at 6:53 p.m.

  Wrong again, Chuckles…

  They get paid for 9 months - many elect to spread that pay over a 12-month period. You had it exactly backwards.

  And I believe the marching and picketing thing is OK these days… something called the Constitution. Perhaps you’re familiar with it?

• 

  The_Seer on August 14 at 8:03 p.m.

  avocet: http://www.k12.wa.us/safs/PUB/PER/SalAllocSchedule.pdf

  Show me one salary on that schedule that is seventy grand. The vast majority of teachers make around 45,000 a year. I also hope you notice the salary schedule includes a 1.9% pay reduction for the coming years. The only thing I “enjoy” about having time off in the summer is that it allows me to expand my business and essentially double my income in those “three months off.” And of course, the 180 days of curriculum I’m expected to deliver for three sections of instruction will magically appear out of the ether, packed in hermetically sealed jars that are set on the desk in my office by pigtailed pixies.

  zagchuck: No one stopped you from becoming a teacher. I suggest if you do, don’t respond “So I can have summers off” when asked during an interview why you were attracted to the profession. That probably won’t go well for you.

• 

  The_Seer on August 14 at 8:06 p.m.

  Oh, and Zag, not only are we not out marching and picketing for more money, we didn’t complain when our salaries and benefits were recently reduced because of moronic policies enacted by politicians you supported.

• 

  Pigrobin on August 14 at 8:47 p.m.

  Based on your table that means the average teacher has 7 years of experience and only a Bachelor’s degree. When I walk into our district’s schools, most of the teachers have 15 years of experience and a Master’s degree. Their average “base” pay is 60K+. I think we are lucky we have that kind of experience, but there are some drawbacks. If you have some bad teachers, they aren’t going to be leaving. It seems, at least for math and English, there are good indicators of how well are teachers are doing. Standardized tests and placement exams are just as much an evaluation of the teacher as they are of the student. If the students in a district are performing at a low level relative to other districts/states, we should be taking a very hard look at what we are doing because it is not working.

• 

  The_Seer on August 15 at 8:38 a.m.

  How are standardized tests and placement exams an “evaluation” of an instructor’s efficacy? Teachers don’t take the tests, students do.

  The problem in U.S. schools is simply one of personal responsibility. My parents imbued their children with that value early in our lives and we would have succeeded in school even if zagchuck were our teacher. Now, when Johnny or Jane don’t learn, parents blame the school and not themselves or their brats. All standardized tests do is measure how accurately a student filled in the bubbles on a test sheet. I proctor such tests twice a year (MSP and NAEP) and some students take their time and try their best on the exams while others breeze through them so they can go goof off in another classroom while others finish testing.

  Look at all the fat kids in schools. Why aren’t people complaining about the P.E. departments? Aren’t they responsible for getting kids in shape? How about health teachers? Aren’t they responsible for setting nutritional guidelines for students?

  Maybe the students are smarter than we give them credit. Perhaps they see how irrelevant advanced math will be in their adult professional lives?

• 

  topck on August 15 at 2:12 p.m.

  Steptoe, Schools are surrogate parents with a limited scope in their surrogacy. Otherwise everyone would be home schooled.

  The schools have a contract with the parents through the state to teach and educate the children that are in the classroom. They are not doing a good job.

  Seer (blind one), If you think that educators don’t have a responsibility in the results of their teaching you should be fired, because you are not doing your job. The quality of the teacher has a significant role in the level of education that one gets.

  Consensus doesn’t work for math or science, and consensus can be totally wrong.

  Did the school board tell the parents how they were doing? No. It was the State.

• 

  Pigrobin on August 15 at 5:19 p.m.

  I feel sorry for educators (I use the term loosely) who see no correlation between their students’ performance and their own teaching abilities. If you don’t get it, you are part of our problem.

• 

  misjustice on August 15 at 5:53 p.m.

  I feel sorry for parents (I use the term loosely) who see no correlation between their kid’s performance and their own parenting abilities. If you don’t get it, you are part of our problem.

  See how easy that was?

• 

  Pigrobin on August 15 at 8:41 p.m.

  You are so clever! Why didn’t I think of that? You’re right, parents should be judged for post-secondary student performance on college placement tests. We never want accountability for the educator. The topic concerns college-bound student performance on math placement tests. My point concerned high school math instructors and they should be held accountable for poor student performance when 80-90% of their college bound students cannot pass a math placement test to secure a seat in a college (100 level) math class. So yes, I would say there is a big problem with a 10-20% pass rate and it may be the students, but just as much blame goes on the teachers. By the way, this has nothing to do with the parents. The students, if they are serious about higher education, are the point of responsibility, not the parent. Perhaps this thread points out the overall inability of people in this country to take responsibility for results when the results suck. If it’s not a problem with the teachers, then our WA public school students must suck. I don’t agree with that position, passing the math placement test is not that hard and we should expect better from our schools.

• 

  misjustice on August 15 at 10:14 p.m.

  I think that parents are as responsible as teachers for children learning; they set the stage for their children’s success. If they don’t require that their kids do their homework, study, and go to class prepared there is little that a teacher can do to ensure that little Johnny is a success. We need good teachers but we also need involved parents; teachers can’t do the impossible.

  And no, before you exhaust yourself jumping to a conclusion, I am not a teacher. But I did take higher math in high school, and struggled with it. If my parents had not been involved and made learning a priority I would have skipped the college prep courses and skated by with basic math.

  I also took higher math in college, and I spent many afternoons in the math lab with a small study group; while most of my peers did not. I graduated with honors, and most of my peers did not.

  My point is that too many folks are quick to blame teachers instead of accepting personal responsibility for their own, or their children’s, learning. Teachers, even great ones, can only do so much.

  Education is one of those things that, generally, you get out of it what you put into it.

  Just sayin’…

• 

  56traveler on August 15 at 11:25 p.m.

  And sometimes it’s just the fault of the student. Although I don’t have kids of my own, a friend of my wife’s asked us to let her young teen son stay with us for a few months to get him away from the gangs he was hanging around with.

  We took him to a very good school, and insisted on doing his homework with him every night. After several weeks, we noticed no improvement in his attitude (not disrespectful (we’d known him since he was a toddler), just lazy — not even remembering the stuff we’d taught him the day before, etc.), and learned from his school that he was causing trouble in the classroom and on the campus. His mother came and picked him up a few days later.

  He dropped out before the 10th grade and spiraled downward ever since.

• 

  BruceDeitrickPrice on August 22 at 5:46 p.m.

  Possibly this article is meant to be comedy. In which case, we should all settle for a good laugh and not bother overthinking the matter.

  It’s not comedy?? Ohmigosh. Virtually all the kids who take math have to take remedial math? But nobody is fired?? Instead, we have to listen to some of the most pathetic excuse-mongering since a four-year-old dropped his cereal on the floor and blamed his sister in the next room.

  Reality check: as long as you assault students with REFORM MATH or CONSTRUCTIVIST MATH, you will have failure. I’m afraid COMMON CORE STANDARDS is more of the same.

  I wrote an article a year ago titled “53: The Education Establishment HATES Math.” Still sounds about right.

  Bruce Deitrick Price