Spokane7
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December 20, 2011 in News, City
City Council backs ‘complete streets’ rules
If Spokane voters approve a new tax to repave a new round of crumbling streets, walkers, wheelchair users and bicyclists won’t be ignored when streets are rebuilt.
The Spokane City Council late Monday, in the last meeting before four of the members will be replaced, voted 5-2 in favor of a “complete streets” ordinance.
The new rule will require that when streets are reconstructed, pedestrian and bike infrastructure already called for within the comprehensive plan – the city’s long-term growth guide — must also be included as part of the construction. That extra infrastructure, however, wouldn’t have to be included if the cost to add it equaled 20 percent or more of the total project cost.
The list of the nearly 30 people who testified on the proposal was one of the longest for any issue the council debated this year. Most who spoke were in support, including those representing schools, the elderly, affordable housing, people who have disabilities, the South Perry Farmers Market, health, businesses who have workers who walk or bike to work and Gonzaga University. There were several, too, who opposed the complete streets rule because of the potential costs.
Councilwoman Nancy McLaughlin, who was joined by Councilman Bob Apple in opposing the ordinance, said while many complete street improvements are worthwhile, the city shouldn’t mandate them in city code. She said every dollar spent toward complete street concepts is one that won’t be used on crumbling pavement. She said supporters should instead work to add specific pedestrian and bike improvement projects into the next street bond vote that could be on a ballot as early as next year.
“The desire for complete streets should be (considered) at the voting polls,” she said.
Supporters on the council said the ordinance will open the city to state and federal grants geared toward pedestrian and bicycle safety. They also said it creates a strong, inclusive vision for the city along with exceptions that protect the Spokane’s finances.
“The future of this county is to reduce our dependence on the internal combustion engine,” Council President Joe Shogan said just before the council voted. “The wind’s blowing for the future, and the wind’s blowing for complete streets.”
The rules are largely geared for a potential new street bond. Construction paid for by the property tax approved by voters in 2004 are nearly completed. Projects from the 2004 tax that still haven’t been built are exempted from the ordinance. Outgoing Spokane Mayor Mary Verner has worked to prepare a second round that could go before voters as early as next year. During the mayoral campaign, Mayor-elect David Condon expressed support for asking voters for a second street bond.
The city has defined projects paid for with the 2004 as “curb-to-curb” only and hasn’t financed much pedestrian or bike infrastructure as part of it except for sidewalk ramps at intersections.
Dr. Matt Hollon, an internal medicine physician and member of the city’s Bicycle Advisory Board, told the council that adding infrastructure for bicyclists and walkers will help encourage more people to exercise. Dealing with the country’s obesity epidemic “on a patient-by-patient basis approaches futility,” he said.
“It’s about making walking, jogging and biking immediately accessible to all our citizens,” Hollon said. “If you are working for Spokane and you care about the health and well-being of spokane, you will support the complete streets ordinance.”
Advocates for the blind and other people who have disabilities, said a complete streets law will help make the city accommodating.
Walt Mabe, who uses a wheelchair, said the city is in desperate need of safer streets. Many curbs don’t have ramps and even ones that do are often pointed in a way that force wheelchair users outside crosswalks.
“We need to make it safe for everybody,” he said.
But some told the council that the proposal will force costs up, thus increasing taxes.
Carol Black, a former city employee, said supporters make “complete streets” sound like the ordinance will turn the city into a utopia.
“I would love to have something like that here,” Black said. “That would be great. But the trouble is I can’t afford it and neither can we.”
Cindy Zapotocky, former chairwoman of the Spokane County Republican Party, said with European economies “teetering on economic collapse,” Spokane’s economy is not likely to improve soon.
“There is much we all want that we can’t afford,” Zapotocky said. “For now, please defer expenses so we are not a poorer community.”
Zapotocky also questioned if the council should take up the issue in the last meeting before four members will be replaced. Council President Joe Shogan interrupted her testimony to scold her for calling the council “lame duck.”
Councilman Steve Corker said that if the council worried only about cost, the city would never strive to be something better.
“It’s a document that’s trying to tell us what our city should be like,” Corker said.
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DickAdams on December 20 at 9:57 a.m.
Speaking of bicyclers, just yesterday, in my travels, I was shocked by the number of people on bikes who completely ignored the rules of the road (many more than usual). A motorist doing the same as the bikers, surely would have gotten a traffic citation. I wonder how many bikers have been issued tickets? My observation is that many, many bikers violate the law every day. I think, Its time to do something about it.
Lulubelle on December 20 at 10:10 a.m.
and I am shocked!! shocked I tell you!! at the number of motorists in Spokane who violate the law everyday! Red light runners, speeders, cell phone talkers, tailgaters, crosswalk runners….completely ignoring the rules of the road! For the sake of everyone, it’s time to get motorists off the road!
Dazzeetrader11 on December 20 at 10:45 a.m.
The council ( the outgoing greeenies) just retarded ( like lulu is) the ability to build new streets. If it’s true that every new street will be necessarily accompanied by bikelanes and some special provisions work up to 19% of the project, say good bye to streets. The add on kills the project.
Libs really don’t care…they just want their “idea”. Hollon is nuts…and wrong. There is now and never has been an increase in longevity due to runnning, biking or walking.
Not a shred of evidence. Same with health insurance…it doesn’t make you live longer. Nanacy had a very good point, the country was trimmer and apparently in better physical shape 50-60 years ago WITHOUT “complete streets”…this is key.
Lots of parks in Spokane…few use them but they are available for exercise. Fat epople eat wrong and don’t exercise. No amount of fancy streets with bike lanes, etc will make them exercise. This is AMerica…fat/obese non exercisers who eat too much. Period.
Further, this is not the time to add on expenses for street building. Spokane can barely afford streets let along the extra cost. This will be reversed by the new administration. It should be. I don’t want to pay for someone to walk and ride bikes and take out traffic lanes. This isn’t California…Portland or Olympia.
As I watched, all references to those places make me laugh a bit. There is no way to turn S]okane into a nice weather place for 7-8 months of the year. More hallucinations from the left. Having normal people pay for the left’s fantasy seems wrong.
This ‘ll be gone..and it should be. SPokane struggles with streets. Add ons kill off street building.
Bruce (aka thatoneguy) on December 20 at 11:11 a.m.
Spokane needs more sidewalks. Someone who wants or needs to walk — anywhere, for whatever reason — should be able to do it without having to risk their life by walking in the road. This would be a good use of tax dollars.
Verbal on December 20 at 11:47 a.m.
I don’t necessarily have anything against “complete streets”, but all I have read simply states something to the effect of “pedestrians, bicyclists and automobiles all sharing the road together”. What does that look like, exactly? Do we currently have any streets that fit this description here in Spokane?
One more question: Would “bicycle infrastructure” mean alternate arterials for bikes as opposed to having them on the main arterials designed for motorists (I would be for this, as it seems like it would be a safer approach).
freeheeler on December 20 at 11:54 a.m.
This is a great step towards creating an environment suited for everyone…not just motorists. People complain about the cost and the economy and worry about being able to afford these updates….however these are the same people that have no problem continually fueling their automobiles to get around and not taking the opportunities to actually commute to their jobs or errands on foot or bicycle or even public transportation. Pretty hypocritical in my eyes.
Exercise is proven to enhance one’s life, health, and lifetime. Anyone who says otherwise has a few screws loose. Keeping your health up through exercise will ultimately improve your body, mind, and pocket book.
Yes, this is not Portland, Olympia, or California…your geography knowledge is impressive. This is Spokane and we should create the best city for everyone. This plan is not only for cyclists, but for pedestrians (mobile and handicapped).
Please realize that automobiles are not the only form of transportation and guess what…Republicans, Democrats, Non-Partisans, and “Greenies” have members that ride bikes, walk, are healthy, are unhealthy, are mobile and are handicapped.
This plan is for everyone. Enough said.
freeheeler on December 20 at 12:00 p.m.
One more point…50-60 years ago we were trimmer because we didn’t eat nearly as much processed foods and not everyone had a car so they had to walk/bike. Times are different and change needs to happen as we change as a society. Fear of change only prohibits progress.
Dazzeetrader11 on December 20 at 12:22 p.m.
Exercise has NEVER been shown to prolong life Free. If you think so, please post some evidence…a medical study or something. I’ve kept o top of the literature and there is no evidence I’ve seen.
Sure it does some nice physiology things, but no prolongation of life.
People SIT more and they gain weight. They eat more and they gain weight. Complete Streets won’t change that. If you think so, is there any relationship to sidewalks and weight loss?
Californians are trimmer because the weather is nice..at least in some areas. SO people go do more. Busy society in the Southland. I suppost the same can be said for the people living in mild weather areas in general. Spokane isn’t so mild…
CougarGold on December 20 at 12:33 p.m.
Dazzee - I normally refrain from responding to your comments. However, this last one regarding extending life, I take exception. Maybe extending life isn’t the way to look at it. Perhaps NOT extinguishing life prematurely would be better. With today’s diets and extreme climb in obesity rates, diabetes is on its way to becoming epidemic. Heart disease kills more than any other affliction. Diet and exercise are key to avoiding these pitfalls. Exercise may not prolong life but lack of it can surely lead to an early exit. And I’m not a liberal so it’s not a political discussion and never has been.
Having stated the above, I am not in favor of the complete street dictate in that I think it’s too broad. For example, under the newly passed plan, I think the Second Avenue project would likely have eliminated at least one traffic lane in favor of the complete street upgrades. This is counter-intuitive as Second is busy enough as is. The increased automobile congestion would act to add carbon and slow commute times as cars sit idling at red lights more than currently experienced. I don’t have an issue with certain planned bike routes and also agree with the idea that we need sidewalks but a blanket, broad rule is too far-reaching in my view.
larry_b on December 20 at 12:35 p.m.
Simple fix, license and tab fee’s to said riders. The argument will be though that they are already paying for their vehicle, why pay for a bike? Make a choice healthy people, you cant have it both ways….!
riverlaw on December 20 at 12:52 p.m.
Weather does not have anything to do with the rate of biking. It is the infrastructure to support it. Minneapolis ranks #1 for urban cycling and has MUCH worse weather than here. See http://www.bicycling.com/news/featured-stories/1-bike-city-minneapolis
Dazzeetrader11 on December 20 at 1:13 p.m.
Minnesota isn’t Washington. 0.01 of 1 percent bike here.
Update: Even though the lame duck Council approved the Complete Street plan, there is a street plan and bike plan, an integral part of the approved plan,there is NO pedestrian plan. The rush to approve the whole plan before the lame duckers depart engendered a big mistake. Nice way out. Nothing except loose verbage even talks about pedestrians. If you all have seen a pedestrian plan, post it. I read the plan…nothing but nice “chat”. Surely nothing approved.
The plan they approved may well just fall aprt without the ped plan. Typical of the governance Spokane’s had for the past four years. A very big “ooopsie”.
Goldie..you’re just rephrasing what people usually think. Lack of exercise doesn’t led to an early exit. Contrariwise, lots of exercise doesn’t lead to anything but better physiology. If you have data, please let us see it. Id there was such a study , don’t you think a Nobel would have been given out for it? I know it would. It’s the missing link that might assure the outcome most want.
We struggle to be fit. We also struggle to live longer…not connected though. In some cases, resulution of Type II diabetes might help reduce morbidity…even there though, it’s tenuous evidence. In the top or low 10% of those afflicted maybe there’s suggestive evidence..but in the vast and general population, nothing so far.
CougarGold on December 20 at 1:48 p.m.
Dazzee - Here’s one for starters; link between obesity and diabetes. And if you claim that having diabetes doesn’t lead to a shortened life, I’m likely to scream…
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/06/090621143236.htm
mj_crites on December 20 at 1:54 p.m.
“the country was trimmer and apparently in better physical shape 50-60 years ago WITHOUT “complete streets”…this is key.”
If you look at Spokane of 50-60 years ago what you see are vibrant, walkable, neighborhoods. This is exactly what “complete streets” seeks to do, to create vibrant, walkable neighborhoods. If you want to bring back The Good Old Days complete streets is part of how to do it.
Verbal on December 20 at 2:42 p.m.
Was the general population really that much healthier 50-60 years ago? Didn’t nearly everyone smoke like chimneys back then?
Also, I would greatly appreciate it if someone could answer my questions above, or point me to a website that looks at the subject objectively (or as objectively as possible)
mj_crites on December 20 at 3:11 p.m.
Verbal, does this help:
Dazzeetrader11 on December 20 at 4:08 p.m.
Sidewalks were the same 50 years ago as they are now.
Curing of diabetes should lead to increased expentancy…type 1 or II. Two occurs usually in adulthood ( ie adult onset diabetes)……we can control some it. We now have insulin…didn’t have it decades ago…kids died. We now have purer forms of it too…but secies insulin too. Outside of that though, no increase in life expentancy has occurred. Sorry…it’s not true just because you say it Goldie. Type I has changed very little in death rates…the ulcerations and eye changes go on and on. It should change ( although the extensive complications present may not reverse) with stem cells…trials are in progress outside the US with decent results.
Overall life expectancy has improved…not because anything you cite though…it’s happened as they species evolves. Think the prevalance or coronary has dropped? It has. Men were on average 5 ft 3 in 1000 years ago. Mortality on average was 43 years too. We’re changing…. nothing to with skinny ness though…Weaker ones die younger. We, as humans., have done little outside of the basics.. ie curing of infectious disease. polio. and a few other things. Reduction Coronary heart disease is being drummed out of the gene pool. Fewer heart attacks…fewer coronary related events too. I used to work fro NIH and still consult. Your over your head kiddos. I monitor and explain these data when referreeing grants and contracts.
We have bypass surgery which we didn’t have 50 years ago. We CURE rheumatic fever too.. It’s medical science and a genetic change ( like we’re taller now) have changed mortality …and extended life.
Improvements in life expentancy have nothing to do with exercise.
And NO pedestrain plan either. The dimwits in your city hall didn’t get it in. I don’t doubt there will be sidewalks though..as it’s always been…not because of pressure from the greenies either..it just gets done. COndon should work on problems within CIty Hall….like budgets. Pinks slips for the workers/unions or pavement. Which would YOU chose? Verner chose unions….AND this ridiculous complete street plan…like any liberal she chose “heaven” but couldn’t pay for it…with raising taxes on everything. Well, everything isn’t in the cards .
Get back to work SPokane…forget the Christmas trimmings…it’s the core you need….not the silliness.
mj_crites on December 20 at 4:16 p.m.
“Sidewalks were the same 50 years ago as they are now”
Yep! But the population, the amount of traffic, and the development patterns sure aren’t. Complete streets updates things so we can get those vibrant, walkable, neighborhoods back.
Gmaw on December 20 at 5:05 p.m.
Fifty years ago there were neighborhood stores now I have to risk life and limb if I want to walk to a Grocery Store. The speakers that made the case for complete streets were well informed and did not result to name calling. I am grateful for the council and their vision for Spokane.
freeheeler on December 20 at 5:12 p.m.
What Dazzeetrader11 is basically saying is that all is perfect, besides that everything is f@#ked.
Life is about learning, changing, growing, understanding, and seeing….try it sometime.
No reason to respond to this either as I am done trying to state a point to where we are as a city, nation and world.
Dazzeetrader11 on December 20 at 5:57 p.m.
Oh Im fine with some improvements…a word though…the population doesn’t drive on sidewalks even though the bikers do. Population has increased but not in SPokane….Valley and North..yes. Let them do sidewalks out there. SPokane’s population in 200K now..it’s was 1290 50 years ago. Not much. The sidewalks are fine.
The reall issue is expense. Spokane is financially under water since Verner lost her green mind and spent wwhile there was a known deficit.
Sorry Free…we improve when there’s money for it. You dream all you want..dream up some money to put in new sidewalks too. Bike paths too. No money to do anything but put in new streets and fix the old ones. Still though..all the dreams in the world won’t conjure up the money …to do anything really.
Green means money…not greenie ideas.
You lefties get the green money and Condon will spend your money on streets. Forcing an idea by 30 people who spoke last night is ridiculous..unless the council is predisposed. Amber, Shogan, Corker, Snyder and Rush are predisposed….3 of those are gon ein 2 weeks. the other 2 will be gone too. Key is that the council and mayorship will be common sense. Green is part of common sense…just not everything.
Read the above twice. SInce there’s not a complete ped plan, it goes out right away. SOme sidewalks..just not what the greenies want..and not for health ( ridiculous idea)…done because it should be done. Not mandated. If you don’t like it…tough. Reality strikes…not mandates.
mj_crites on December 20 at 6:37 p.m.
Spokane’s population has grown by 6.8% in the last decade and will continue to grow. These new residents are going to have to have a way to get around and Spokane can not increase capacity on quite a few of it’s roads. You can’t add lanes to Ash or Maple north of down town. You can’t add lanes to Summit or NW BLVD.
What Spokane can do is build infill development with complete streets so that you have walkable neighborhoods and the rate of car use stays the same or goes down.
DDC on December 20 at 6:49 p.m.
Teenagers are always coming up with great idealistic concepts that they won’t have to pay for. Unfortunately, the shoe’s on the other foot now, and it’s the adult generation that seems to never run out of ideas their kids are going to have to pay for.
What a shame.
Spokane_Citizen on December 20 at 7:59 p.m.
Look….responding to Dazzee is pretty much like responding to Shadedmuse….at worst, feeding a troll, and at best, a waste of time. They’re just two sides to the same dingbat coin.
greenlibertarian on December 20 at 10:39 p.m.
And people wonder why Spokane in particular, and the country in general are going to hell in a handbasket.
1/3 intelligent posts here that made sense, both pro and con on complete streets concept.
2/3 sheer ignorance, tomfoolery, duncecap musing.
Thanks Jimmy Marks.
DDC on December 20 at 11:17 p.m.
I knew the Marks’….and the Stones’…grew up with them. Good families.
DickAdams on December 20 at 11:50 p.m.
“lulu”, forgot to mention photo red, speed traps, unmarked cars using trucks, SUVs and the list goes on where LE makes a killing in revenue in the millions of dollars. I merely was wondering how many traffic citations have the bikers received. These bikers who violate the traffic laws should be fined the same as drivers of automobiles. Another Idea might be for all bikers to take a test similar to drivers. At least that way they may learn a little bit about the rules. I`ll say it again, I couldn`t believe the bikes on city streets and how indifferent to traffic laws that I witnessed in downtown..
arroyoribera on December 20 at 11:52 p.m.
Just as a point of fact, I was the first person to call the council a “lame duck” council during Monday night’s meeting. Mr. Shogan chastised me, as he did Ms. Zapotocky, and literally “quacked”. Shogan’s quacking aside, calling the council a “lame duck” was entirely appropriate. “Lame duck” has been defined as:
1) An official (esp. the president) in the final period of office, after the election of a successor.
2) An ineffectual or unsuccessful person or thing.
So the council was in fact, as I and later Ms. Zapotocky pointed out, taking on many important issues in what amounted to a lame duck session for Shogan and others who will be replaced by successors on the council.
Among the issues the council, under the direction of the lame duck Shogan, addressed right around midnight as the city slept and most members of the public in attendance had long ago left, was the issue of restricting first amendment rights via an ill conceived new noise ordinance. The new noise ordinance would empower and train Spokane Police Officer to use their hearing and “judgment” to determine who and what sounds exceed the state’s noise restrictions. That’s right. SPD officers who don’t have the training or judgment to correctly apply use of force criteria are going to hold their hand to their ear and declare a bullhorn or saxophone or other noise “legal” or “illegal”, subject to a criminal penalty of $1000 and 90 days in jail. Can you see it now? Killer cops like Dan Torok roaming downtown citing street musicians, protesting tea-partiers and occupiers, and any other noisy nuisance they see fit. Not!
In other words, late in the night the council was on the verge of voting on this rights-restricting ordinance. Even “liberal” Jon Snyder stated, after hearing all public testimony, most opposed to the new ordinance, that he was prepared to go ahead and vote at that moment. Fortunately less arrogant and more prudent minds prevailed. The noise ordinance was put off until April 2012.
Meanwhile, we have now seen the end of the “quack” Shogan as council president. As Council president, Shogan routinely abused his authority and the public trust by humiliating, threatening, bullying and intimidating members of the public who were simply taking advantage of the 3 minutes of democracy the council permits members of the public during council meeting.
Last night Shogan was in his usual form, interrupting, bullying and threatening a member of the public who had the nerve to rise to speak appropriately about the ADA in regards to Complete Streets and the need to accommodate disabled persons, particularly those in wheelchairs. Before the gentleman reached the microphone and repeatedly after he began to speak, Shogan berated, threatened and bullied.
During Shogan’s term, a cowardly council and others failed the people of Spokane by not carrying out an “intervention” early in Shogan’s term as council president, demanding that he deal with his anger, control and abuse issues. Quack on, brother Shogan…somewhere else.
DickAdams on December 21 at 12:13 a.m.
arroyoribera:
I`ve sent countless letters to the city council, with a copy to Mayor
Verner about the embarrassment to Spokane regarding Joe Shogan and his behavior, advising the council members they should be doing something about his temper, his outlandish comments to citizens offering testimony if they happen to disagree with this pseudo intellect watching his conducting the city council. I question to myself whether or not he might need medical help. I`ve even mentioned it to the council and mayor.
AmericaErwache on December 21 at 4:38 a.m.
To DickAdams regarding Joe Shogan:
The reason Joe Shogan acts that way is because LIberalism is a mental disorder. That’s it. it has been diagnosed.
mj_crites on December 21 at 2:30 p.m.
Talking to a post?
arroyoribera on December 21 at 6:40 p.m.
DIckAdams, Thanks for responding and for having attempted to address Shogan’s contemptible and abusive behavior as council president. I remember when he was running for office. It was the Garland Street Fair and Shogan was distributing flyers for his campaign. He approached me and with the foulest, most unhappy expression on his face, shoved one of his flyers into my hand and walked off without a word. I always figured his wife had told him he was going to get out of the house one way or another and that he decided being council president would allow him to work our his anger and venom over being gaveled down so many times by judges in court. Whatever the case, good riddance. And to anyone considering Mr. Shogan as a future attorney, be advised that it will not serve you well to have your attorney rise to address the judge and mispronounce the judge’s name. As council president, Mr. Shogan routinely and repeatedly botched the names of members of the public, even those with simple and easily pronou cable names, including those who came before him frequently. All that said, his brow-beating and attempts to threaten people into abandoning their right to speak before the council should have been addressed formally long, long ago.
Dazzeetrader11 on December 22 at 1:00 a.m.
Spokane, the city is the same in population. When you say “Spokane” has grown by 8.6%…you’re talking about the County. I’m sure you’re not trying to deceptive…facts are he facts though.
Fix the streets…the rest is simplye desert.
Or at least do the correct thing and put it to a ballot vote. You bike types will lose….first things first. In fact, since there’s no pedestrian plan, that goes out right away. You might think the council emembers who voted for something not in existence might know that before spending your money.
Now comes the bikes…no special treatment…of course with a bike license, a license to test skills on a bike, tax, etc…I doubt any of you bike lovers would like to pay for your biking pleasure.
Fair’s fair. O and don’t forget your bike insurance…sounds equal to me. Of course you can always pay for your own bike highways…preferably in alleys so as to not clutter up the roads:)
mj_crites on December 22 at 1:25 p.m.
Spokane (city), Washington
Population, percent change, 2000 to 2010 6.8%
http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/53/5367000.html
Spokane County, Washington
Population, percent change, 2000 to 2010 12.7%
http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/53/53063.html
mj_crites on December 22 at 4:24 p.m.
Bicycles were defined as vehicles and guaranteed a place on America’s roads before there were automobiles on the roads.
This really comes down to a question of Spokane plans to grow and develop over the next couple of decades. With much of Spokane very constricted in terms of how much automobile capacity can be added to the road networks, building infill development with complete streets, that would allow for more people to live in Spokane but keep the amount of auto use about the same, is really the only choice Spokane has.