May Day Wild Card — 5/1/09

71 comments on this post so far. Add yours!

• 

  Nick_Adams on May 01 at 10:52 a.m.

  Interesting take from Kevin Richert at the Idaho Statesman on regular HBO contributor Gary Ingram winning an Open Government award (plus $2000) during a year when he opposed changing Idaho’s Open Meeting Law. A move which was supported by the Idaho Press Club and the Idaho Attorney General.

  http://voices.idahostatesman.com/2009/05/01/krichert/odd_honoree

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 10:58 a.m.

  A little common sense regarding the Swine Flu.

  http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/04/29/Swine-Flu.aspx

  “All a pandemic means is that a new infectious disease is spreading throughout the world.”

  “As of May 1, 2009, 11 countries have officially reported 331 cases of influenza A(H1N1) infection and only ten deaths in the ENTIRE world from this illness. At this time ALL of the deaths are from people born in Mexico.”

  And if you want to find the source of the hype, follow the money trail.

• 

  Lynne on May 01 at 11:02 a.m.

  They said a black man would be president when pigs fly - 100 days in - swine flu.

  Sorry, but I thought it was funny. lol

• 

  Sisyphus on May 01 at 11:08 a.m.

  Interesting link CB. I agree on the pharmaceutical company angle but I’m curious on how they feed the hype. Are they tied into the CDC? It wouldn’t surprise me since they damn near own the FDA.

  Wow I missed that Nick. Thanks. Speaking of following the money, that’s is a bizarre turn of events. Betsy should have received that award. Its as silly as putting Larry Craig in Idaho’s Hall of Fame.

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 11:17 a.m.

  Sis, money can feed the hype. The media loves a good “story” to sell the papers so the hype becomes self-feeding if you will. All it needs is the push from a few medical and government personnel. And who doesn’t love to see their name in quotes?

• 

  Sisyphus on May 01 at 11:24 a.m.

  Well sure in a general sense. I was just wondering if you had some data.

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 11:43 a.m.

  No, I don’t have any data on it Sis. I just got this link today. I had the general feeling that all the hype around this was contrived to some extent.

  But Dr. Mercola put together an excellent article. Well done and it shows how easily the masses can be played when something like our health is involved.

• 

  Arpie on May 01 at 11:50 a.m.

  When I came to school today somebody had put Betsy’s article featuring Representative Nonini’s thoughts about “golden parachutes for those people,” by the notebook we use to communicate school business. My usually mild mannered, nice, apolitical colleagues have written underneath that he is, “The south bound end of a north bound horse.” Another one says, “We will continue to rise above this sorry excuse for a human and make magic happen.” Even though we aren’t in Post Falls I think he may be losing the teachers’ vote.

• 

  Sisyphus on May 01 at 1:17 p.m.

  Ya think Arpie? I’m sure he knows it. I expect he’s banking on it.

  Speaking of dance, Dave. I’m surprised you haven’t written up a post on Snowball.

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7IZmRnAo6s

• 

  trishgannon on May 01 at 1:56 p.m.

  Cabbage Boy, regarding media “hyping” swine flu (and let me say I don’t know that they’re not - I’m glad not to have television!) why is it that in some instances, market forces are prime (who cares what cigarette companies do, no one is forcing you to smoke!) but in others, especially this one, media is the big bad guy… I mean, no one forces anyone else to buy a newspaper, right?

  Don’t get me wrong, I have a lot of issues with what MSM calls ‘news’… but I do get irritated with media being blamed that something is ‘hyped.’ Hype’s not gonna matter if no one’s paying attention.

• 

  toadman on May 01 at 2:10 p.m.

  However, Trish, I think CB may be on to something this time. Fear and Paranoia ‘sells’ news. It gives them content. It sells advertising dollars because it’s a “story,” no matter how benign the swine flu actually is (and it IS benign, believe me. It’s no more dangerous than REGULAR flu, and we haven’t closed down schools for THAT, have we?)…it’s new, and sheeple are easily scared.

  The commercialization of news is disturbing to me. Mind you, I’m not one to nationalize the news either, I think that would be a slippery slope to state controlled media…but when news stations/papers/media are concerned with generating add revenue with the stories they run, it seems that there could be a conflict of interest.

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 2:38 p.m.

  Irrational reporting leads to hype. Hype is definitely in effect when my son said his schoolmates and baseball teammates were all talking about it.

  Shame on parents who allow their kids to get sucked into the hype. Knowledge is one thing. They should be vigilant and use proper hygiene. But my son echoed my sentiment about they hype, when telling me they were discussing it everywhere he agreed that kids probably shouldn’t be so exposed to the news.

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 2:39 p.m.

  I should say, kids shouldn’t be so exposed to the media. News is good. We talk about news with our kids all the time. But kids need some filters.

• 

  toadman on May 01 at 2:48 p.m.

  I dunno Cabbage, demonstrating water boarding to my five year old during his bath was pretty effective.

  ;-)

  ….just kidding.. don’t call CPS, ok?

• 

  Cindy_H on May 01 at 3:10 p.m.

  “But kids need some filters.”

  Personally, I don’t believe children should be smoking at all, but I guess CB is right. If they’re going to light up, better be filtered.

• 

  trishgannon on May 01 at 3:34 p.m.

  No Toad, I think you’re wrong, though I’m obviously prejudiced as a publisher.

  You say a story sells news, and that’s not generally true, not at the specific story level. Advertising is set far before story content. That’s true in print, appears to be true online, and is probably true on television. A sensational story can generate newsstand sales, which ups the percentages for total sales and is more attractive to the advertiser, but for that to make much of a difference you have to have sensationalist news almost all the time.

  Also, you characterize swine flu as benign. For some weird reason I’m a “fan” of viruses, have been for a long time - I’d like to go to work for the CDC in my next life. While I tend to suspect swine flu may turn out to be benign, there simply isn’t enough data to make that determination.

  Regular flu kills less than one percent of those infected (approx. 36,000 deaths, approx. 1.5 to 4.5 cases - flu is not reported to the CDC). For this flu in Mexico, data is really limited… but the last time I looked at the numbers they had about 3,000 suspected cases with 160 deaths, roughly a 5 percent mortality rate. The data pool is too small to give reliable statistics and will likely remain so, as most people are not being tested - that the test readily available indicates only a swine flu A that’s not of human origin (hence “suspected”) Currently a confirmed determination can only be made by CDC (though tests are supposed to arrive in some areas today that can be done on site). Still, not every case is being tested because that 5 percent potential mortality rate is high enough to generate concern. Think about it… go with 3 million (mid-range) for typical flu infections; at 5 percent, that’s 150,000 dead. Not to mention that, relatively mild or not, most of the people we’re seeing are really, really sick… not working, not spending, at a time when the economy is as fragile as can be.

  We’re not seeing the deaths (percentage wise) in the US and no one really quite knows why yet. Did Mexican patients not get treated in time? Has the virus mutated just by crossing the border (not considered likely)? There’s going to be concern until that question is answered.

  But the focus right at this moment is to limit spread. That’s crucial. We have 350 million people in the US and just 71 million doses of antiviral in federal and state stockpiles - if the antiviral is the only thing keeping the fatality rate down, then we certainly don’t want to allow a widespread epidemic. And that means telling people, over and over, DON’T SHARE YOUR GERMS. Stay home, cover coughs, and all that jazz.

  In addition, it’s hard not to correlate with 1918 when a flu appeared at the end of the flu season (like this) which seemed relatively mild (like this) and came back in the fall with the ability to go from symptom free to dead in hours. Actions must be taken now to prepare for that eventuality, because next flu season will be too late.

  Finally, public health professionals understand very quickly that viruses mutate rapidly, and that this particular virus (which shares genes from pigs, birds and humans) might find it easier to pick up other traits from all three of those other types of flu viruses it comes across. Right now, there is a human H1N1 circulating that is resistant to the antivirals that this flu is susceptible too. The last thing we want to see is this flu getting the opportunity to pick up those resistance genes.

  The “sheeple” you mention shouldn’t be scared, but they should be cautious and definitely be aware that if they blow this off, they might well end up with a situation that will scare them half to death. Or maybe all the way to death.

  Okay, there’s my rant. Thanks for the opportunity. ;0) Like I said, I love this stuff. Greatest mystery in the world.

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 3:40 p.m.

  Trish, did you read the article?

  “Just a couple of months ago, scientists concluded that the 1918 flu pandemic that killed between 50-100 million people worldwide in a matter of 18 months — which all these worst case scenarios are built upon — was NOT due to the flu itself!4

  Instead, they discovered the real culprit was strep infections.

  People with influenza often get what is known as a “superinfection” with a bacterial agent. In 1918 it appears to have been Streptococcus pneumoniae.

  Since strep is much easier to treat than the flu using modern medicine, a new pandemic would likely be much less dire than it was in the early 20th century, the researchers concluded.”

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 3:42 p.m.

  Even a humble citizen such as myself can speculate good reasons why the mortality rate is much higher in Mexico. When you consider the impoverished conditions of much of Mexico, the poor nutrition and people living in sewage drainage areas, it makes me wonder the mortality rate isn’t higher.

• 

  toadman on May 01 at 3:51 p.m.

  I dunno Trish.. there’s also ratings to consider (where television is concerned)…and I’m speaking mostly to cable news, where pretty much anything goes, which is unfortunate.

  As for the sheeple, I just think that if people want to be afraid, they’ll find something to be afraid of…some people allow fear to rule their lives.

  For my own part, I’ve not changed anything I was doing before (re: personal hygiene)…I wash, I cover with my sleeve, and I use hand sanitizer as well.

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 4:05 p.m.

  The ratings argument falls flat also. If ratings, sales and web site hits weren’t important, they wouldn’t measure them. It may not be immediate ROI, but it certainly is part of the measure.

• 

  trishgannon on May 01 at 4:07 p.m.

  Yes, I see that guy makes the statement that secondary bacterial infections killed people in 1918 but a subscription was required to even read his article that might state information to back that up, that could be checked. Hard to evaluate that as anything (maybe fearmongering against tamiflu?) without information to check.

  CB, there were no blood or tissue samples kept from any of the 1918-1919 victims of the influenza outbreak and virology at the time was non-existent. We don’t actually know what they died of.

  What we do know is that in 1936 swine influenza A H1N1 was identified. People who lived during 1918-1919 that were tested showed the presence of antibodies to that virus. People born after that flu epidemic showed no antibodies. That’s the science behind why it’s believed that swine influenza A H1N1 was the cause behind the 1918-1919 epidemic.

  By the way, I’m not a tamiflu apologist… I believe the pharmaceutical industry is responsible for much of the illness we see today. Should I get swine flu would I take it? I don’t know. I was forced to take… can’t remember which antibiotic when we had whooping cough epidemic here several years back. Within one day I could no longer stand straight and quit taking it. Never got whooping cough, either.

  But mild? I don’t know about you, but I and most of the people I know have to be pretty darn sick before we ever go to a doctor… and that’s the case with most of those who make up current statistics (that’s changing rapidly as people are now going in to be tested if they have sunburn). But you should read the CDC guidelines on what samples are being requested for further testing… they’re NOT from patients with mild illness.

• 

  trishgannon on May 01 at 4:24 p.m.

  Toad - you sweet, clean man… after this is over, consider throwing the hand sanitizer away. They contribute to antibiotic resistance.

  CB - You may think of Mexico as poor and dirty, but bear in mind that they get flu every year just like we do and don’t see this percentage of deaths from it. This is unique to this particular virus.

• 

  toadman on May 01 at 4:30 p.m.

  “…after this is over, consider throwing the hand sanitizer away. They contribute to antibiotic resistance.”

  I only use it after I poop. Most of the time I lick my hands clean then wipe them dry on the nearest door knob.

  ;-)

  But you’re right. The best evidence for evolution is the rapid mutation of these viruses toward drug resistant forms. The more we kill them off, the more they evolve into resistant forms. This is why we NEED to inoculate, (meaning, create antibodies), instead of kill them off. This doesn’t stop the mutation or rapid evolution to resistant forms, but slows it down quite a bit.

• 

  Cindy_H on May 01 at 4:33 p.m.

  “Most of the time I lick my hands clean then wipe them dry on the nearest door knob.”

  Bad Toad, bad!
  Now I don’t feel so good.
  Is nausea a sympton of the Swine Flu, or just the result of reading Toad’s comment?

• 

  hmoffsuite on May 01 at 4:36 p.m.

  toad >> ” only use it after I poop ……etc ………

  Thanks for sharing that with us.

• 

  Cabbage Boy on May 01 at 4:38 p.m.

  Trish, I don’t think of “Mexico as poor and dirty” just that there are many people living in horrid conditions there. And if I may ask in all sincerity, how do you know they don’t see these mortality rates with the ordinary flu? Since you seem to know quite a bit about this, I assume you have done some research on that?

  I couldn’t get that article of reference open either. But I am highly skeptical of large pharmaceutical companies. The temptation to make money at the suffering of others has been their calling card. I can’t remember which ones, but some were heavily involved in testing in Nazi Germany.

• 

  hmoffsuite on May 01 at 4:52 p.m.

  CB. It would, or will, take big pharma companies considerable time to develope a vaccine or antidote. And, the R and D costs would be considerable. So, they spend a lot of money and when they have something, the virus deal is over. Then, they have lots of medicine that won’t work on the next virus d’jour.

• 

  brentandrews on May 01 at 5:56 p.m.

  OK Merry Hucksters, here’s some Chronic Discontent from the road:

  Arizona, Beautiful / http://chronicdiscontent.wordpress.com/2009/04/30/arizona-beautiful/

  Seen in Indian Country / http://chronicdiscontent.wordpress.com/2009/05/01/seen-in-indian-country/

  Y’all come!

• 

  brentandrews on May 01 at 5:57 p.m.

  Shumbuddy wanna tell me how to hotlink here, I would ‘preciate it. Email brentandrews1973@yahoo.com or the old alter ego at thomas@chronicdiscontent.com

• 

  brentandrews on May 01 at 5:57 p.m.

  No nude photos, thanks.

• 

  trishgannon on May 01 at 6:21 p.m.

  CB - No, actually I was unable to find any reliable statistics on annual morbidity/mortality rates in Mexico. Instead, I rely on the Mexican dept of health concern that they were seeing a higher than expected percentage of influenza deaths, along with the fact that deaths were occurring in populations not generally considered at risk… i.e., healthy young adults as opposed to the very old, very young, and immunosuppressed.

  I think we probably agree on several fronts, but let me be clear. At a personal level, I’m concerned with a pandemic because I don’t want myself or my family to get ill - especially when there’s a risk of death in atypical populations (which we represent). But public health is not concerned with health at an individual level per se - they look at a regional/national perspective (or global, i.e. WHO).

  It’s simply not good business sense to allow a bunch of people to get sick and/or die. Therefore public health recommendations may be beneficial at the higher level, but detrimental at an individual level. A good example of that is vaccines.

  As far as preventing spread, I’m hand in hand with public health, out of enlightened self interest. I understand exactly what they’re concerned about right now and why.

  If it comes down to a situation where the spread was NOT prevented, however, I might make personal decisions that don’t match up with public health decisions.

  I have a feeling you probably agree with that.

• 

  trishgannon on May 01 at 6:37 p.m.

  BTW - an example of the difference between public/private health concerns.

  A couple days ago (2? 3? can’t remember) we heard a 40 year old man in Spokane county was a suspected case of this flu.

  We hear TONIGHT that his son is also a suspected case. They say the kid has stayed home from school (but not for how long).

  I doubt it took them this long to determine a probable case had a son who was sick with flu symptoms. The information wasn’t provided because they didn’t want people to panic. With the announcement of the sick student, they also say they’ve undertaken an investigation and that there is “minimal risk” to students at the school he attended.

  As an adult, I can understand why they did it this way.

  If I were a parent with a kid at that school, I would be p’d off.

• 

  brentandrews on May 01 at 8:07 p.m.

  Give Me My Medical Marijuana Now, Or Die / Chronic Discontent http://chronicdiscontent.wordpress.com/2009/05/01/1752/

• 

  brentandrews on May 01 at 8:18 p.m.

  If I Run Out Of Beer, You’re Toast / Chronic Discontent / http://chronicdiscontent.wordpress.com/2009/05/01/if-i-run-out-of-beer-youre-toast/

  Y’all come!

• 

  spokelooneh on May 01 at 10:40 p.m.

  The recent swine flu is a terrorist attack from Mexico. They want the Southwest back. I heard it on Michael Savage, so it’s the God’s Truth.

• 

  JIMMYMAC on May 01 at 11:15 p.m.

  Haven’t gotten to post as much as I’d like on HBO lately as work has beckoned some long hours as of late, but if you are a sports fan at all, game 7 of the Bulls-Celtics game on Saturday will cap one of the greatest NBA playoff series in the sport’s history. I’m not a huge NBA fan, but the playoffs are usually worth watching and this series has had it all. 4 of 6 games going overtime, 2 of which with multiple OT’s, blood, drama, David vs. Golitah showdown, storied franchises, etc. Cannot wait.
  nothing but love from Jimmymac to the HBO world.

« Back to Huckleberries Online

• ›Scanner traffic